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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 01-04-2003, 12:36 PM
BigMattie10KingQuad's Avatar
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

Over the years i've really enjoyed riding 4 wheelers. Some good and bad come with it but mostly good times and nice people along the trail. We own a couple of ATV's such as 94 King Quad, 2000 Kodiak, and a 2001 Kodiak. I wouldlike to point out a few thigns in regards to the King Quad, Ive found lot of interesting ways of fixing and or upgrading it. first, the front shafts wqhich cost $250 plus are best removed by using a muffler clamp. You put the clamp around the shaft house which holds the CV joint and tighten it so it wont easily slip off, making sure the braket is facing out and the use your drift pin and mallet to drive the shaft from the front differential. Doing it this way save yrouself any possible damaged to the shaft houseing.
Another good fix is the linkages for the 4 wheel driver and Differential. Keep the well lubed and addusted so they go in and out of gear really easy. takes some time to adjust it tooth by tooth but its nice when they go into gear really easy.
One of the biggest things the King is known for is Crappy brake systems, mine included until i did some thinking on it. LEts start with the rear, i disassembled the rear brake and baked off the adjustment screws on the foot pedal. Then you go back to the rear brake and throughly clean the brake drum, the shoes, the rear brake cover with the oil seal and scrub the backing plate on the bike itself. One of the biggesst things you must make sure are clean and free from pitting or rust or any type of imperfections is the rear hub that the big oil seal rides on, if it has grooves or scaring or anythgin but a shiny very smooth service you need to buy a new one or take it to a machine shop and have it grinded. not turned on a lathe, you need it very smooth. only take off enough to make it completely 100% smooht as glass. THe type of oil seal that rides on that hub is a made of Viton material it is very hard and wears through the steel. so grewase that area alot witht he #3 grease that stopps 90% ofhte water.. once all of that is down let it dry completely. use hot soapy water at first and then use brake cleaner to suck up any moisture from the shoes. Doing this in the summer is nice , but in the winter you just have to make do. once all of the brake components are completely clean and dry set them to the side. What you are going to do now is make a custom flat rubber seal. I made a template out of wood first. I took the rear brake cover with the oil seal in the center of it and set it on a piece of wood and VERY carfully traced it out on a piece of wood. this has to be very accurate so pay close attention to it. use 1/4 inch thick luan plywood its cheap and wont bend and light weight. Iafter you traceed it out, i used a jig saw to cut the outer portion away and then used a corddless drill to make the holes. once yo uhave a template, then get a piece of rubber. Don't use anything thicker then 1/8 of an inch. that may cause problems. then set the template on the sheet of rubber and trace it out with a white marker so it shows up on the black surface. then you should use a grease with an NGLI #3 on both sides of the rubber seal. the #3 grease is a much thicker grease then you usually find its really stiff and doesnt just liquidfy maintaines its consistancy like silicone like.. grease the seal on both sides and set it on the brake cover to align it to the backing plate and cover. it really works, its stops 50-75% mudd that usually gets past. I ride in stream beds and in snow alot and i only have to replace the rear pads once a year. you have to keep taking it apart every other ride or so , but that is to make sure it is working correctly and and you make yoru brake adjustments too and too clean any dirt that got in.. just a precaution. i always want my brakes to work. so i check them every ride.Also make sure you use a water proof type grease for all your springs and levers to keep them moving easily. That is the rear brake fixer or helping idea... try it you might like it.
THe other is for the front brake assembly. Make sure all your seals are in good shape if not replace them. its costly but ill tell yo uwhy. THe backing plates on the front need to be taken off and sand blaster and then painted with a EPOXY paint. so it is very smoooth. then you buy new orings for the hub and the lug nuts. i matched up a couple that were a couple sizes thicker and it help fill the void and then i used the #3 grease and it helps keep out 80% of the water and mud that get into it.

My question now. who has done any engine work such as replace the valves and have a larger piston put into it. how much work is it and how is it done.
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Old 01-04-2003, 01:25 PM
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

Hey, thanks for the tips. They should come in handy one day.

I'm about to undertake the power thing myself. Check out the other thread by me for the details. I'm sure my experience with car engines will help, but then again I've never messed with an ATV engine before. It seems as though you HAVE to get a new cylinder sleeve with a bigger piston. Apparently the factory didn't put enough "meat" in the cylinder to take a bore job.

If you know how to adjust the valves on these things, please let me know. This ticking and pinging is driving my crazy.

JB
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Old 01-04-2003, 11:05 PM
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

damn if you hear ticking and pinging you havve yoruself a big problem. also depends on how long its been doing it too. But you certainly need to buy the Service Manual from Suzuki. explains how to do it very easily. you can bore it out .020 or .040. once you get past 40 over you need to resleeve it and start over. by then through the bike out and get a new one. But the valves you need to adjust ASAP.. TextText
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Old 01-04-2003, 11:23 PM
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

Powroll used to have a big bore kit for the KQ. If I remember, it bored the motor so the displacement was around 311cc instead of 280cc. Their site is www.powroll.com. It might be worth an e-mail. I also remember they had listed some very useful tips for engine work.

Hope this helps.

Mark
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Old 01-05-2003, 12:19 AM
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

Man thanks for all of the brake info! My idea to solve it is to make custom disc brakes. Anybody tried this?
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Old 01-05-2003, 11:46 AM
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

Quote:
Originally posted by: BigMattie10KingQuad
damn if you hear ticking and pinging you havve yoruself a big problem.TextText
Nah, it's not a big problem. My bud's 95 quadrunner did the same thing and a valve adjustment by the dealer cleared it right up. Actually, it's really only noticable at idle and when I get down on it. But I never have the time to take it to get them adjusted.

Are you sure the KQ cylinder can take a .040 over? Man, that's pushing it on many of today's car engines. That's a lot of metal to take out on such a small cylinder. You might run into cylinder distortion if you're not careful.

I'm sure that a do-it-yourself portjob on the head, bigger carb, and and good jet kit tune will do wonders for these machines. A dremel, die grinder set, and some port lube is all you need. When you port, try to concentrate on the short-side radius and port-match the intake pipe to the head along with enlarging the runner a little. Then smooth out the walls to cut down on the turbulance. Even doing a little unshrouding around the valves in the combustion chamber could help. JUST DON'T TOUCH THE VALVE SEATS!!!

KQT...I know it will be expensive, but you might want to look into buying the spindles, discs, calipers, etc. from the dealer for the new KQs which have them from the factory.
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Old 01-05-2003, 02:38 PM
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

.040 is to specs from WISECO. call them they havea Kit for the bike. if yo ukeep the bike ater that bore job the next one you would need to resleeve it. I only use proven parts and proven data and talk with people who actually know what they are talking about. so do yourself a favor.. have it done by a professional.

As for disc brakes on the front, the 2002+ come with disc brakes, and the parts would cost $1000 to upgrade an older bike to dics. so you cuold save yrouself some money, and take the 1000 you were going to spend and trade yrou bike in and get 2500 or so for it and get a new one that cost 4000$.

THe valves are important, if you want yrou bike to run right, keep everythign tuned up right and good gas and clean, and do all the preventative maintence. buy the Suzuki service maunal it tells you alot about how to maintain it. but if you were to do a compression test, that woudl tell you some thigns as well. if you do a top end kit on it, piston and valves. everythign new that shows wear then do a jet kit, you should be alot more happier with the bike. I am in the process of buyign the parts as we speak to do jsut that. new piston kit .040 and all new valves and a KN power kit. then im bumpiung up to a meater tire. other then those options, nothing else much you can do with a 280cc king quad.
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Old 01-05-2003, 03:37 PM
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

You're right, I do need to get the service manual.

If 1"= 25.4mm, then 0.040" is about 1.01mm. Going from the stock 68.5mm to 69.51mm bore will increase your disp from 280cc to:

(69.51mm^2 x 76mm x0.7854)/1000= 288.4cc

That's why I'm searching for a big bore kit that comes with a new (bigger) sleeve so I can actually get some displacement that's worth the money. The machine shop I'm familiar with around here can bore, hone, magnaflux the cylinder and sleeve, and balance the rotating assy. I might be somewhat new to these engines, but not engines in general. Like I mentioned in the other thread, Mickey Dunlap used to have a 331cc kit for the KQ and I believe he used Wiseco pistons. We'll know in a few days when that forum is opened. A 74.5mm bore by 76mm stroke will net you just a little over 331cc. If I still feel uncomfortable about doing this with the locals, then I'll do like you suggested and just remove and ship the engine to, say, FST and let him do it. Yes, I "actually know" (your exact words) how and why an engine works, just not the specifics of the KQ engine. You can do more than just bolt-ons to any engine.

I'm not trying to make this thing a dragster or a duner, I just want more torque. If there was a stroker kit I would do that, but no luck there. We're both trying to reach a common goal, so don't be too quick to knock out a possibility when it arrises.
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Old 01-05-2003, 04:12 PM
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

i agre with what yoru saying inregards to bolt ons. but hte big concern is cost. why would you want to put $2000 or $3000 in a bike that will never giv eyou what you want. but a 650 Kaw. that is the best beast on the market today, actually the Griz with the independant. is better. check the specs. seriously i understand you point but i think you want more the king can give you. Id save alittle money and do the cheaper route on the botlt ons and piston kit and power kits and work with the brakes somemore and hope for hte best. if that doesnt do it. then sell it.. because 280 or 310cc's will never be the same as 660 or 700..
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Old 01-05-2003, 06:10 PM
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Default King Quad brake Fixes and Engine Questions

And I agree with you too, you couldn't be more right concerning the beasts of today's market. And I plan on getting a P650 when they decide to give it a manual shift and IRS. But it's what it's worth to the owner that really counts. I personally love the unique drivetrain and reputation the KQ has. I don't want to build it just to be "better" than today's machines, I want it for the pleasure of working on the ATV I like and to make it better than the factory did. It's just a project, or hobby if that word fits better. My philosophy is: if it's YOUR machine, YOU build it how YOU want it and forget what bad stuff anybody has to say about it. Right?

I really doubt that it would take more than $1000 to build and tune a big bore KQ like the one I'm after. It's just something unique that would be fun to do. Besides, wouldn't it be awsome to have a KQ that will run with at least a lightly modded 500 or 600cc beast?

All this talk about Suzuki getting Kawi's 650 engine has me wondering. Maybe the people at Suzuki will get smart and drop it in the next King Quad. King Quad 650 V-twin.....now that would be one BAD ride!

You sound like you have a good bit a experience with these engines. I'll keep you in mind when I get started on this thing in the future. I'm sure I'll need a little advice here and there.

Have a good one,
JB
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Old 01-05-2003, 06:10 PM
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bore, brake, brakes, cylinder, fix, how, hub, king, powroll, quad, rear, replace, seals, sleeve, suzuki, to



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