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Posted by: mmmbeefy
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Originally posted by: GPBOYZLT250
Got a story to share: this past tuesday we went out to our local riding area. We took an ice chest with WATER AND GATORADE and some shovels to make us a cool little jump....q]
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Was there some sort of surveillence device in the cooler? Did the Gatorade rat you out? I think the REAL lesson to be learned here is that "six-pack racks" aren't as nerdy as everybody thinks...
Posted by: 2fun
Good message, but you had to post it three different times in three different places???
EDIT: Make that SIX times in 5 different forums!!!img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif" border="0">
Posted by: 2fun
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Originally posted by: kayaker001
start learning how to run.
I have a better idea.
How about you DRIVE (I know a rediculous idea) to a designated riding area???
When I go to the dunes, the closest one is 2 hours away. The one that I USUALLY go to is 3-3/12 hours away.
No tickets (if you are within the sound limits), and no cops trying to chase you either.. HHMMmmmmm....
Posted by: 2fun
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Originally posted by: GPBOYZLT250
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Originally posted by: AcatMAN -- it is people like this guy that give respectful atv riders a bad name. that is why people do not allow trails to go through their land, do not support atving and will do anything to have a negative effect on the sport. good job...keep up the good work!
YOU KNOW WHAT!!! its people like you taht PISS people like me off...i will keep up the good work..next time i will out run them...and hopefully it pisses them off enough to outlaw the damn things...hopefully in YOUR STATE!!!!!!!
Now THATs a pretty damn wise thing to say...................
Posted by: 440EX026
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Originally posted by: kayaker001
i live in new jersey and i run all the time because you cannot ride anywhere in this state and if you stop they take your bike 90% of the time. if one of the people i am riding with gets caught they just say that they don't know who the other riders are and that they just met up with us. i've been running for 20years and never been caught, but that's how we all learned to ride around my town.
Fist thing I got to ask is how many damn threads does this guy (GPBOYZLT250) have on this subject?
Jersey is deffinately very different than most of the other states, and except for NY, CT and a couple of other "anti offroad" states we have a problem that most outside of here just cant fully understand.
Kayaker your only a town or two away from me and I know what your talking about, and its hard to explain this to these guys who have not had to deal with it etc, but its just not right to be chased down, ambushed, tricked, and basically jumped on while riding out in the woods and more so than the guys who pretty much ride down "main street" and all of it is pretty much only for the income to the state and towns plus a strange way of repaying some of the "eco" groups for their political contributions.
On a whole I say its never smart to run from the law, and most times it will only come back to bite you worse etc (this was explained better in one of the four other similar threads lol) but when your in a situation like we have here in NJ and your targeted as a form of income and the laws have been written like they have for riding in the various forests I cant blame anyone for taking their shot.
This is part of the main reason offroadnj.com was started as they are trying to organize the riders to combat the state to stop this insanity.
Posted by: 440EX026
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Originally posted by: Bigdaddy660R
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Originally posted by: kayaker001
it sounds like your state is going in the same direction as mine so start learning how to run.
OK 1st, I do not like politics........2nd I'm real sorry to read that it comes down to running from law enforsment........
REMEMBER: who elects your STATE and LOCAL goverening officials.........REMEMBER: who elects the sheriff of your town or city..........and most of all REMEMBER: their is POWER in organized CLUBS and PARTYS and people that beleive in our sport..........
If running is what you want to do, so be it and GOOD LUCK (cause your going to need it)
If you truly beleive in our SPORT OF ATVing get involve and MAKE YOUR STATEMENTS of how you feel known to your LOCAL and STATE goverments........
I am quoting you because you hit the nail on the head and are 100% correct in your thinking.
Not that there were not any other good replies but this deals with the cause and remedy to the problem and none of the others would really help long term.
Moving can help, but running away from your neighborhood and problems (look at what happened to brooklyn etc) doenst work long term and only leaves others to deal with the problems.
Running or not running are only short term too, and getting involved in making a real difference in fighting for our right to enjoy our sport, and even politics in general is the only thing that is going to make any difference long term.
So we all have many choices, but as far as I can see if most of us dont chose to become involved both in supporting our sport and in our political system as a whole were totally screwed long term not only due to having no legal places to ride, but also in having the few remaining rights we enjoy as Americans lost like so many before.
OffroadNJ
Posted by: 440EX026
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Originally posted by: MBullism
kayaker001-
We have the atv patrols as well. Our registration fees recently doubled to pay for additional EPO patrols on state land ( EPO=Environmental Police Officer, a.k.a. game warden...they have juristiction). We also have several local PD's that have recently gone before their local board of selectmen and said that they can't enforce the laws from their cruisers (because knuckleheads run), and now several local departments have ATV's as well. We also have landowners that hire off duty cops to patrol their acreage on the weekends...
As far as learning to run... I'm trying to impress apon this 15 year old kid that I've learned not to run, and it appears that he's learned the lesson the hard way. The important thing is that it appears that he's learned early enough with little consequence. If you guys in NJ have a three strikes and your out hanging over your head, then running will do nothing to change that, it will only get worse.
I am really sorry to hear that your state is following suit behind our mess of a state, but until this BS progresses into the more rural or conservative states etc the riders there will not fully understand what is happening in other areas.
Honestly until your hunted like a serious criminal how could you believe or empathise with this even happening?
So maybe we will get lucky and all the efforts of the few to benefit the many will prevail over all of our well organized and funded enimies, but I am just not betting on it and will try and convince all those that I can to become involved and make a difference.
Also one last thought on the mess you describe about legal obligations to maintaining a state owned trails system etc. I think you guys really need to seek some legal council because the wording on the non hiway portion of the federal gas tax and how its divided and distributed and to be used by the states is pretty much in conflict with what you describe.
I know there is more than one person who is involved here that is considering a potential legal action for the proper use of these $$$ as described by the fed.
Posted by: 440EX026
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Originally posted by: GPBOYZLT250
you know what 440ex....your right...and so are you bigdaddy..but we werent in/arent in/have no orginization to be in so running was our only "plan" i guess....and ya now i know it was the stupid/but fun/ thing to do...lolhr>
I wont get anymore into the "stupid idea" thing as it seems to have been covered by all angles already, and you are old enough to know what your doing and the complications and conseqences involved etc.
What I will tell you is that if you cant find an atv or offroad group to join in TX your not looking very hard.
Even if there are none set up already near you thats little more than an invite for you and your friends to joing together and start a chapter of another group for your area or even start up fresh on your own.
Do a search on the net and if you dont find any groups I will post some for you too look into, and most that I know of are as much a riding club as a political one so there is plenty to be gained beyond being politically active.
Posted by: Bigdaddy660R
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Originally posted by: kayaker001
it sounds like your state is going in the same direction as mine so start learning how to run.
OK 1st, I do not like politics........2nd I'm real sorry to read that it comes down to running from law enforsment........
REMEMBER: who elects your STATE and LOCAL goverening officials.........REMEMBER: who elects the sheriff of your town or city..........and most of all REMEMBER: their is POWER in organized CLUBS and PARTYS and people that beleive in our sport..........
If running is what you want to do, so be it and GOOD LUCK (cause your going to need it)
If you truly beleive in our SPORT OF ATVing get involve and MAKE YOUR STATEMENTS of how you feel known to your LOCAL and STATE goverments........
Posted by: Bear4570
If you run, the cops can charge you with any number of offenses from minor charges up to some major felonies that can get you over a year in jail. Otherwise you turn a ticket into a loss of citizenship that can ruin the rest of your life.
Posted by: Bear4570
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Originally posted by: GPBOYZLT250
ya but im only 15 so they cant put me in jail....and the guy said he didnt blame me for running..cus i told him how i was on my friends quad.
Young man, if you believe that can't put you in jail, you are flat out wrong. And anytime you run, for whatever reason, you are flat out wrong and they can jail you.
Posted by: Bear4570
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Originally posted by: kayaker001
mbullism i don't think all cops are a-holes but in nj they have atv taskforces that ride around on atv's and catch you. and when they get you they take your atv everytime and you don't get it back until your court date is over and all fines paid, plus they tag you vin# and if your vin# get tagged 3 times they get to keep it. also anywhere you ride in nj is trespassing. you can find more info on dirttdogg.com about it. i't sounds like your state is going in the same direction as mine so start learning how to run.
So move out of the Peoples Republic Of N.J. I would not live in California for like reasons. The radical liberals have way to much control (even though they are not a majority) and of course they know better than everyone so instead of punishing the wrong doers, they outlaw everything, like Constitutional protected items, not just ATVs.
Posted by: MBullism
Let me interject an unrelated/related flashback. Never lose sight of the fact that your actions today will dog you tomorrow. At 15 it seems like forever away, but I know two people that cannot own shotguns for hunting in MA because of stupid crap they pulled as a juvenille. Don't tell me that stuff can't follow you. And don't fool yourself they can't touch you cause your too young.... they are patient...they talk amongst themselves...and they don't forget. All of a sudden you do something minor at 18 and it comes down major.
Bear is right, as soon as you run it takes a teeny thing and makes it huge. Doesn't matter the infraction.
.02
Posted by: MBullism
Not to take away from the situation in NJ, but to say that everyone that lives outside NJ (or CT or NY or a handleful of other states) can't possibly get it is noisemaking. Until 1996 there were more than 30 state forests in MA open to ORV's... when the liberals and tree huggers were done focusing their attention on them...there were 6. And of those, the only ones open to quads are in the western part of the state (with the exception of one teeny one on the north shore). Now this year they've closed another, one of the biggest. Any trip to any legal riding area requires planning and a day trip for most of us, and frankly a trip to ME or NH is easier. The open space that we do have may as well be out of state. We pay taxes, bow to mandatory registration, our clubs have to enter into contracts with the DCR to maintain trails donating thousands of manhours to trail upkeep (for which the state is reimbursed by federal funding), etc, etc. The state is making money off us and "giving" damn little in return... I've heard of bikes being impounded and big bucks and court visits to get it back, I know a someone that was literally ripped of his bike as he rode by a town cop, and another that had a gun put in his face, and this is just local stuff. The point is that the outlaw mentality is part of what cost us thousands of acres to ride.
Now, my ranting above aside, the cops are people too, and some of them own bikes. They get it. Nine times out of ten you will get what you give. A little respect goes a long way. Not always, but most times. And the landowner has a lot to do with it. The more they complain about bone heads, they more the cops have to listen to them, the harder they are likely to come down on you.
I expect someone from NJ will reply and tell me that that is not how it is in their state, the cops are all aholes gunning for your ride... but the knucklehead that started this thread was trespassing, had brought a shovel to build a ramp, and knew that it wasn't his land, but thought that because it was "rundown" it would be alright to dig it up more. Like I'm to be impressed that a 15 year old only had "WATER AND GATORADE"...Sounds like the cops and the landowner have about had it... and after all that he got a warning-
You guys will never get a legal place to ride with that mentality... keep running, and when you finally get caught, it could follow you...
.02
Posted by: MBullism
kayaker001-
We have the atv patrols as well. Our registration fees recently doubled to pay for additional EPO patrols on state land ( EPO=Environmental Police Officer, a.k.a. game warden...they have juristiction). We also have several local PD's that have recently gone before their local board of selectmen and said that they can't enforce the laws from their cruisers (because knuckleheads run), and now several local departments have ATV's as well. We also have landowners that hire off duty cops to patrol their acreage on the weekends...
As far as learning to run... I'm trying to impress apon this 15 year old kid that I've learned not to run, and it appears that he's learned the lesson the hard way. The important thing is that it appears that he's learned early enough with little consequence. If you guys in NJ have a three strikes and your out hanging over your head, then running will do nothing to change that, it will only get worse.
Posted by: MBullism
I'm afraid that's the 15 year old in him talking... GPBOY, do us a favor and just drop it. Remember the people that are in the best position to make things difficult for ATVers in NJ frequent forums like this and won't hesitate to quote anything you offer if it furthers their agenda.
I give you high marks for "learning" from your bonehead move, but you lose all credibility when you don't know when to quit. The folks above got it right... you don't like it the way it is? Change it or move. If you choose to continue on the path you're on, it will only get worse in NJ. Think it can't get worse? Keep running. Keep trespassing and "building ramps". In ten years you'll look back fondly on these being the good ol days and wish you'd had been pro active. It'll fall away slowly, I assure you. You'll wake up (grow up?) ten years from now wondering what the H3ll happened...
The only way we as a group will help our sport is by organization and strength in numbers, and the realization that most of NJ is no longer frontier...
Posted by: tyzorg
LOL
Posted by: MrTommy
Hey bear, I just read through this string and when I got close to the end I was of the like opinion that if your state doesn't like, want or allow quads anywhere, then sell your quad or MOVE. It's like owning a dirt bike in Manhattan, NY and complaining that there's no dirt park on the island. Otherwise you just plan to end up with your stuff confiscated and your hard earned money paying a bunch of fines.
I think this is why when you go on eBay to find a used quad, they're all on the east coast, or at least east of Denver. There's just nowhere to ride back there. It's a damned shame, but I don't think I'd own one back there.
Posted by: GPBOYZLT250
Got a story to share: this past tuesday we went out to our local riding area. We took an ice chest with WATER AND GATORADE and some shovels to make us a cool little jump....well it wasnt our land but it was a rundown place..anyway a sheriff started coming in the back entrance so we took off out the front..when we got there another sheriff was about 200 yards from that entrannce on the road..he turned around and chased me: on a grizzly, my friend: on a 400ex, and another friend: on a ttr 125....the guy on the dirtbike stopped after bout 100 yards..he gave up...and got cuffed and put in the car..me n my bud ran about 2 miles to a friends and hid out there..about 5 min later i got a call from my sister saying the cops are at my house (about 3 miles away) and theres a warrant out for my arrest and that there were 3 cops surrounding my house...so i went home because they said they would go easy on me if i did....and they were right..they gave me a criminal/trespass warning...meaning that if i get caught again i will be taken straight to juvenile...and if i would have not ran i would of only gotten a verbal warning...so the moral of my story: dont run!! but hey we had a good time while it lasted!!!!!
Posted by: GPBOYZLT250
ya but im only 15 so they cant put me in jail....and the guy said he didnt blame me for running..cus i told him how i was on my friends quad.
Posted by: GPBOYZLT250
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I think the REAL lesson to be learned here is that "six-pack racks" aren't as nerdy as everybody thinks...
Wut are you talkin about??? we didnt have a sixpack rack?!?! we had it straped to a freakin grizzly....
Posted by: GPBOYZLT250
you know what 440ex....your right...and so are you bigdaddy..but we werent in/arent in/have no orginization to be in so running was our only "plan" i guess....and ya now i know it was the stupid/but fun/ thing to do...lol
Posted by: GPBOYZLT250
haha....true, true
Posted by: GPBOYZLT250
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Originally posted by: AcatMAN -- it is people like this guy that give respectful atv riders a bad name. that is why people do not allow trails to go through their land, do not support atving and will do anything to have a negative effect on the sport. good job...keep up the good work!
YOU KNOW WHAT!!! its people like you taht PISS people like me off...i will keep up the good work..next time i will out run them...and hopefully it pisses them off enough to outlaw the damn things...hopefully in YOUR STATE!!!!!!!
Posted by: AcatMAN
it is people like this guy that give respectful atv riders a bad name. that is why people do not allow trails to go through their land, do not support atving and will do anything to have a negative effect on the sport. good job...keep up the good work!
Posted by: kayaker001
i live in new jersey and i run all the time because you cannot ride anywhere in this state and if you stop they take your bike 90% of the time. if one of the people i am riding with gets caught they just say that they don't know who the other riders are and that they just met up with us. i've been running for 20years and never been caught, but that's how we all learned to ride around my town.
Posted by: kayaker001
mbullism i don't think all cops are a-holes but in nj they have atv taskforces that ride around on atv's and catch you. and when they get you they take your atv everytime and you don't get it back until your court date is over and all fines paid, plus they tag you vin# and if your vin# get tagged 3 times they get to keep it. also anywhere you ride in nj is trespassing. you can find more info on dirttdogg.com about it. i't sounds like your state is going in the same direction as mine so start learning how to run.
Posted by: kayaker001
and remember gpboy you did get away until your friend told the cops where you live
Posted by: kayaker001
all i can say is it must be nice being able to ride wherever you want and not having a worry about it.
