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Posted by: Andy Bassham
He will win. My 89 300 honda can hold its own with my AC500 to a certain extent. All of the engine work and the small stock tires should have a major advantage over a 500 lugging around 4 27x12" mud tires.
If you are having handling problems at high speeds, it could just as easily be your tire pressure. 20lbs. is just too much for anything other than straight mud riding. At any high speeds, mine would buck you around pretty good when they had 9lbs. in them. Thats why they only had that pressure for about 20 minutes (thus being the pressure that was in there when I got them back from being mounted).
As far as your drags, you could probably still get him on the top end. I think he will have the acceleration easily though. Cilliberti said that he lost a couple mph on top with his old 97 300 when he put the big bore kit on. He also said that he had the punch to keep up with anything he rode with though. That included the quads he had at the time, those being his 98 Suzuki 500 and his 97 Prarie 400.
Posted by: Andy Bassham
I'm guessing that you are talking to Boner seeing that I just said the 300 would win the drag. I don't see the Honda gaining much top end though. Maybe it will, but I'm going by what some other guy said so I really don't know much about it. The 300 should be able to out accelerate the 500 with all of the modifications.
Come to think of it, I remember you now. You are the guy that lists all that crap at the end of each post. I see that its mainly modifications and stuff now, rather than tie down straps and every set of tires that you own. Much better.
Whoa!! I take that one back. Seems you have taken the time to go back and include all that other bothersome Sh@t. What a waste of freakin space. I am glad for one thing that its all on a honda, and mostly stays in the honda forum. I'd hate to have to scroll through all that mess in every thread on the AC forum. Hmmmm..... I wonder what will be next. Possibly a post in all of the topics here with a signature full of boasting about rack bags and whip flags?
Posted by: Andy Bassham
I didn't catch the part about the stock tires. Still, I was running on pavement with 9lbs. in the tires, and it was squirrely as hell. When I dropped down to 6 and 5 lbs. front and rear, the handling improved. If you have moved your tie rods any, that could easily do it though. The lift could also change that angle too. It would seem that way at least with the a-arms extended. Much like that of a Baja truck, or the rear end of a King Quad. I still think that 20lbs. would have some effect. It would make the quad bounce around a lot more at speeds over 30mph.
I do remember that Gordon had the 313 kit instead of the 355 or whatever it is. He did though, tell me a lot about it in a mile long email he sent me back in 1998. This was when I was still looking for a quad, and at the time I was asking him about his 500 Suzuki. He said that the kit lowered his top speed by about 2mph, but his power output gain was enough to keep up with everyone else fairly easy. He didn't ride with any Polaris's though much, and of course we know that they are generally the fastest quads overall. (This was back when they had mainly 2 strokes all in their lineup).
From what you say, it seems like this guy's quad is better suited for winning a drag race than Gordon's old quad. Again, thats what I said. I think he will win. He may not, but it will be neat to see. I've never raced anyone with mine, so I don't really know. All I have to go on is the feel from riding one to another. Honda 300 4x4's are not particularly fast, and in stock form will not have a chance. Seems like the big bore kit and other things might give it an edge though, because AC's aren't really all that fast either.
The fastest thing I have ever ridden is a 96 Warrior. People downgrade them a lot to give you an idea that they aren't very fast, but then again they are comparing them to other sport quads. Against a utility, no chance. My 2wd Honda 300 will do 51 all out on pavement. Thats straight from the GPS. Back whenever, a friend had this warrior and we switched for a while on the pavement. Long paved roads that you can pretty much wind out most of the time. He could wind out the honda, and I could pull along side him on the Warrior in 4rth gear. All I had to do was gun it to leave the Honda behind, and there were still 2 more gears there. All these folks that say a Warrior will only do 55 are nuts. This thing would do 60 in a heartbeat.
The thing that gets me is that my AC will max out at only 1mph more than the Honda will. Granted it takes the honda longer to get there, and on top of that the 4x4 is a slug compared to the 2wd. Still though, with the big bore kit, it may give it the acceleration edge, but you would have to do a lot to give it a top speed edge.
Hurry up and get this thing on so we can have some results to talk about.
Posted by: Andy Bassham
Good point on the light kit. I liked that one.
Posted by: Andy Bassham
The 6 is the hotter plug. 7 is medium, and the CR8E (stock plug on a 500) is the colder. Basically, 8 for warm climate, 7 for medium, and 6 for cold. I would have thought that the hotter the plug, the better it would run, but for some reason, mine runs faster with the CR8E than the CR6E. I put a brand new 6 in last month after having the 8 in for about 6 months, and I immediately noticed about a 4-5 mph drop in top speed. Whats up with that? Maybe the jetting or something.
Posted by: BONER
Well friday I finshed my rear end up. All I have to do now is bolt the right rear on. I wasn't sure about HL's lift kit so I gave them a call and found a flaw in there directions. IT says both brackets should point backwards, this is not possible with out alot of bending or cutting.
IT turns out that the left side should be the opposite of the right side. The L-bracket should point forward on the left side that is.
After I did this I pulled off my right rear wheel(I put the lift kit with the tires on, but it's easier if you take them off) so I could change my rear brakes. Well I found out that I waited alittle too long to change them. My inner pad wore down to the bare metal and scared up my disc alittle. The outer pad is ok, but it wore out unevenly too. I MIGHT replace the disc or get it turned down if I have problems with it in the future, but I can't as of now. While I was at it I went ahead and removed my mechanical foot brake. I never use it any way. I was gonna remove it totally intack but it was getting dark any my I was in a rush so I went ahead and cut the cable. Not like I'm gonna reinstall it any way.
The lift kit should take you less than an hour with air tools to lossen it all up. I did it all with hand tools and I had one hell of a time lossening the right shock bolt, it was realy stuck but I got it. I recommend you do both sides at one time. If you don't you will have one hell of a time getting the bolts in and out of the 4 link suspension to get the suport brackets on. With the rear axle level it was perfect tho.
Here is what I used( had to imprevise cause of a lack of tools):
1 Excovator(no jack)
1 chain(tied ATV to Excovator's bucket)
1 hand truck/dolly( I used it as a jack to lift the axle to line up the bolts with the shock holes)
4 cement blocks(no jack stands)
1 $30 buck Allied tool kit(I need an impack{even if it's 12 volt} and an air rachet wrench thingy)
Oh yea, while I had all 4 tires off the ground I tested the front diff. It's VERY VERY WEIRED on mine. ON the left side I put my foot on a claw of my tires and slowly gave the gas-- it would not pull but I could feel it pulse like every rotation of the other tires. When I varried the throttle by tapping the gas it riped lose and pulled all 4 no matter how much I tired to stop it. Same thing happen with a slight tap of the brakes.
On the right side it seems to pull even harder than the left side. It seemed to stop pulling if I REALY put my weight into holding the tire, but in 2nd gear high range it would still spin lose if it was above 1/4 throttle. Only problem is that when I would let go of the tire and it was not spining it would spin backwards untill the others almost stoped completly.
Do you guys think that the bearings on my left spindle could be causeing this?? There is alot of play in the front end cause of the bearings. I need to change them asap. I will do the right side even tho it is in pretty good shape. I think it;s better to do it now while it is down than haveing to put it down again.
ps-- I start or my Front lift kit Monday after school-- I have a busy weekend.
Posted by: BONER
I'll do the diff test some more tomorrow.
Reverse on Honda's is the lowest gear, on cats first gear is. I know this for a fact for 2 reasons, it goes faster in reverse than 1st gear AND I have read it in my Service manual. It list all the gear ratios. Reverse is between 1st and second gear numeracally. It feels like 2nd gear tho.
I talked to HL about the lift kit and they told me why. Mike designs the lift kits, but Greg writes the directions down. Another reason is that if you put it together off of the bike the rears look ABSOLUTELY the same. The difference is that you have to turn the left side around. So if you put the lift kits together in advance(finger tighen the nuts and put it together to see if you have any parts missing), you should note this about the rear lift. I'll start the front end tomorrow and see what I come up with.
I'm gonna get some more pictures of it tomorrow. I have already taken pictures of it with just the spacers and claws. NOw I will take pics of it with the lift, spacers, and claws.
Posted by: BONER
I have a 1999 Cat which I bought in June of 99. I have about 2700 (VERY HARD) miles on the bike. SO the brakes have lasted a good while. My Bearings were kinda lose before I installed my tires, but in the few miles(100 miles) with them they have gotten about 3 times worse. I expect this cause of my riding style(jumping, 2 wheeling, and just flat out rough on my bike).
Posted by: BONER
Well, I still have not done my front lift kit. With the cold weather and no indoor's way of doing my lift I have left it alone. I did take the front tires off so I don't have to do that when I do get a chance to start on my front lift kit.
I will get to it asap if the weather is ok. I'm not a winter type of person. I MUCH rather being hot than cold. So, with that cold weather I don't do much outside stuff, even if it's to do with my cat.
Posted by: BONER
Well I installed the rest of my lift kit and changed my front brakes too. As soon as put my factory tires back on(with my spacers in the rear) I went to the front and saw a HUGE toe in affect. I mean BIG TIME. I didn't mess with the toe in tho. I decided to ride it first. So I went for a ride after airing up my flat tires to 20 psi. At low speeds I started turning my bars and noticed that it handled ALOT quicker and I loved it. Then as I picked up the pace on asphalt I almost lost control. I thoughy my tires were unbalance by slime that had possibly frozen but it wasn't that kinda handleing that was being affected. In stead of my tires trying to jump off the ground like they were unbalanced the handle bars were trying to rip them selves on of my hands and the quad was jumping side to side. This was due to the huge toe in. The bike don't know which way to go.
So I will be adjusting my toe in next time I get a chance, I need to do it before thursday cause my freind The_law is gonna be breaking in his new 355 big bore and needs my help. We are planing to do a few drag races after the break in is over with.
Who do you guy think will win? He has a 355 big bore, HL power kit, HL lift kit, Rancher stock tires and wheels, a locker, no front rack, and thats about it.
I have stock tires and a lift kit.
Posted by: BONER
Andy,
If you reread my post I said I was running my factory tires and a lift kit as my set up.
The presure is not why it is handleing bad, I've run that kinda presure before and had no problems. Since it's on a smooth asphalt road it's not like the tires are bounceing around on me or anything either.
Gordon also had his bike set up for low end power. He had a 313cc Powroll big bore kit and a Powroll exhaust system at first, but got rid of the exhaust system cause it was made for a top end gain and actually lost low end power with it. Gordon also ran ITP silver steel wheels which weigh twice as much if not more than The_law's stock Rancher set up.
The Law on the other hand has his bike set up for more of a mid-high range power out put. He has an IDS2 Exhaust system with 12 disc in it for maximum exhaust flow(more disc more top end power).
The_Law,
Yea I forgot your cam, but Why the f@@K mention your light kit? I only listed your performance stuff cause we are doing a race, not a "who has the most mods" shoot out.
Posted by: BONER
Andy,
This is the best way for me to show you what happens when you lift an Arctic Cat.
Take a tape measure and measure between the inside of your front tires. Then take a jack and jack the front wheels off the ground. Then measure at the same spot. You will notice that the measurement with it jacked up is about 1/2" narrower than what it was before you lifted it off the ground.
What you described about the King Quad is caster, not toe in or toe out. The lift kit will not affect the caster on an arctic Cat because they have double A-arm front suspensions. Now, on a Polaris the caster is affected, but this is cause they have struts.
I still TOTALLY disagree with you on the psi because there was nothing to make my quad bouce around on the road, no bumps, potholes, etc.
I Think I'll take it on a gravel road tomorrow to see if the gravel gives enough not to effect handleing.
Posted by: BONER
cowboy,
I know that the psi would cause a rough ride, but I'm trying to tell Andy it's not the reason in my case.
I know the tie-rods need to be adjusted, but the damn jamb nuts on the tie-rods are frozen or something. I can't seem to budge them.
The_law does have a VERY nice bike. He has a locker it in yet it steers SO easy. This is cause of his High Lifter lift kit(kinda narrow's the stance of the bike in the front), his new narrow vamps, and his 35 psi(they are 27.5" tall- this is a 26x9.5x11 tire). The things I didn't like about his bike when I rode it is was that it was [b]underpowered[/b](his cam and power kit were not enough to power his 27.5x28.5 inch tires{26 vamps/ 27" claws}), [b]tippy[/b](almost fliped it when I tired to ride it on 2 wheels-- he almost $h!t), I can't stand his [b]hard seat[/b], and his [b]above the foot peg floorborads[/b] which make it fell like a kiddy bike to me. Makes my knees to high if you ask me, but he dissagrees, yet he is taller.
No the rubicon owner is still to chicken to race with me, last time I talked to him he only had 4 miles on the damn thing. I guess he is afraid to use it period.
Posted by: BONER
We were GONNA do his break-in today, but all kinda problems. First, last night he realizes that he can't find his intake manifold (part that goes form the carb to the head/or jug as I like to call it). So he tells me this and I knew were it was before he did. He left it on his jug(I didn't see it but I knew that the idot would do that) when he brought it to get bored out and have the guy port and polish his head. So, he calls the guy up last night and the guy finds it. He said he would leave it out side his home/shop and that we could go get it today.
Then he realizes that he don't have the shims or gap things(WTF you call them? feeler guages?) to set his valves. Well I called up my grandfather and got them. After I got off the phone I jumped on my cat and went to his house to get the tool(not but 1-2 miles I bet). while I was there I talked to him about buying a new 250 4x4 to replace his 110 3 wheeler. He wants a Suzuki but I'm trying to tell him that Arctic Cat is cheaper, better, and has the same drivetrain. Well on the way back I passed threw the spot where I took my jumping pictures at(see my photo album). Instead of jumping I took my time going down and decided to keep the rears on the ground. Well I don't know if it's my lift kit, the 20 psi, or the power increase form taking off my claws, but it wheelied the easiest it has EVER before. I mean I wasn't expecting it to come up that high or easy with such a little throttle I gave it. I think it's the lift kit. [b]What you guys think?[/b]
Well anyway I got home and told him I had the tool. I told him that untill we could get the valves adjusted to just screw the adjusters all the way untill they hit till valves/cam (not sure what end his adjusters are on) then back them off a quarter turn for now. This was so he could run the bike about 5 seconds( after he got the manifold and the bike put together) to drive it into his truck.
Well I wake up this mourning and it's already 11 am. So I jump out of bed and ask my dad if The_law called yet, nope. So I call him. His mom answers and trys to wake him up, I could hear her trying to wake his "sleeping MUDusa" butt. She could not so I told her I would call back lata.
Well, I call him and this time his mom was able to wake him up. He tells me that he will be over at my house in 30 min. I decided I would go fill up my cat with gas while I waited.
Well, I got on my cat and was keeping it slow cause of the horrible handling with the toe-in like it is. Well, I'm riding along and notice something don't seem right. Seem like when I hit a rock or wet spot it makes a funny noise. I also noticed that it had a big power lose, but I figured that my toe-in was causeing that cause it was such drag on the bike. Well got to the end of my road, crossed the main road and got in a feild. I noticed that 2 of my left front bolts on my wheels were loose(I never learn- this has happen before, but this time i caught it before I lost all my bolts). Well, I figured this should be fixed before I got to the gas station and have the wheel fall off. So I went back home and was planing on just tigthening the wheels and going fill up. Well that plan quickly changed as I started hearing a grinding noise every now and then. At first I was thinking "there goes my front diff", but I noticed that when I would turn to the left the noise would stop. Well, I was thinking that maybe thats my bearings are just TOTALLY shot and they are grinding. So, not so bad since I needed to change them any how. I get to my yard and stop, I jump off and look at the inside of the left front.
First thing I notice is metal dust/shavings inside the wheel. I look up and I see the bad part, and where all that dust came from. It's my disc rubing on the bottom a-arm, it also is rubing on the rubber boot that connects the knuckle to the a-arm. So, I pull my cat off to the side and go call The_Law to tell him that I'm out of the race and ride.
Well, I call him tell him that there is no use bringing his 300 here cause I can't ride. He then tells me he also can't run his bike cause he is missing another bolt. A banjo bolt for the oil line. Well after a few min of talking we decide that we are might as well use the rest of the day to go get the Intake Manifold for his bike. So he comes here(after me haveing to give him directions to go around a wreck that had happen about 2 miles from my house). He picks me up and he deicides he wants to go mud riding in his Z71. So, on our way to the interstate we take a sugar cane feild and almost go in a canal cause we were getting sideways from all the mud. We get to the guys house and guess what, the part is not where he said it would be. AND he is not home, BUT after waiting 15 min he shows up and gives us the part(which was locked up in his shop, not where he said he was gonna put it). He also shows me his nice 392ex that has been bored and stroked. It has works shocks, racing plastic, radial front tires on douglas .190 wheels, rear custom grooved turm tamers on douglas .190 wheels with rings, a Procirit pipe, AC?? nerf bars, a dura blue +2 rear axle(looks freaking strong, about 1.5" in diameter), dura blue spacers and offset wheels up front, 400ex levers, aftermarket handle bars, a dune racing front bumper, and a parking brake block off kit. I drilled this guy for about 20 min and he had a good answer for EVERY question I asked. He told us that he was gonna be getting some arms for a 400ex and was gonna have to run 400ex/250r shocks so he wanted to sell his. The_law jumped at this cause he wants the extra lift of longer shocks, but the $250 price tag quickly put him to a slow down. Well before we left I got some cards so if I ever decide to get a cam installed, get my heads ported and polished, or any kinda work that I will allow a shop to do, he is my man.
Well all and all it wasn't that bad. I ahd a good time mud riding, doing 70-95 mph in 4wd high on the interstate(hince the reason he is the ORIGINAL Team Insano member/founder), and talking to a guy with great racing ATV knowlege that wasn't a stuck up(I don't talk to many, but all of them except him have come off to me like that).
Well sorry for the SUPER LONG post, but I figured it was about time I had one of those post about how my day went, lata.
Posted by: BONER
Roman,
This is what I put a few posts above this one:
I know the tie-rods need to be adjusted, but the damn jamb nuts on the tie-rods are frozen or something. I can't seem to budge them.
See it?
Posted by: BONER
Cowboy,
I think you have water that entered from the carb vent lines. You probaly have water in your fuel float bowl. I think you should drain it and collect the contents in a see thru glass to see if you have water in it. I bet you do.
I would also change all the fluids except for the radiator coolant. Also if you don't change your axle fluids, ATLEAST check on them. Change your oil and oil filter. Change your gas. Air out your air-filter for a day or 2. And I think thats it.
Posted by: BONER
Andy,
The CR6E was my stocker, I switched to the CR8E and got a noticeable power boost in the summer.
The reason you noticed a power drop was that the colder weather has made your motor run lean, so the spark plug is not right for the jetting.
Posted by: BONER
Cowboy,
To drain the float bowl you don't have to remove the hole carb. ON mine(I have a differnt carb) there is a screw on the right side that opens the valve to the float bowl. I have to attach a hose to a little fitting so the fuel doesn't drain on the motor. Yours is probaly differnt. Check your owners manual, I think it was in mine.
If you are gonna remove the carb at all do it when the gas tank is off, thats the easier way.
What you could do is drain the carb, remove the gas tank and dump out the gas(do all the oil changing and other crap first). Then PUT the tank in place(don't bolt it down) and put about a gallon of fuel in it. Then run it. See if you can get it to idle normally.
If not, then try to disassemble the carb and clean it.
Posted by: BONER
girthyguy,
Since Arctic Cat recommends this spark plug I don't think he is in any danger of damange.
Did you adjust your throttle cable yet? I did to mine and noticed alot better throttle response. I don't know about topspeed yet cause my bearings and toe in REALY slow my cat down so I can't test it yet.
Posted by: BONER
Cowboy,
Just look in the owners manual for the carb drain, it should be in there. The drain for the fuel bowl will be somewheres at the bottom of the carb. I bet there is water in this bowl.
Posted by: BONER
Cowboy,
Sounds like you are describing the choke cable to me, but I could be wrong.
BTW: It's no bother at all, I have fun doing this kind of stuff. Why else would I be here? Besides, did you do me a favor by giving me those measurements for my future snorkel???
Posted by: cowboy
I love it! Using an excavator as a jack, with chain-awesome! Would like to have seen that, sounds like you improvised very nicely there due to the lack of standard tools. Good thinking! Also, good review of the lift installation and tips-there's some good info there that I'm sure somebody can use for installing a lift in the near future. I wonder why High Lifter didn't notice that bit about the left bracket facing forward, instead of bacwards? Good think you noticed that.
Did you try the front diff in reverse at all? I remember a while back somebody else had the same thing with their 'Cat. The left tire wouldn't move very much at all with all four suspended, but the right would break loose in a heart beat, spin like mad. They also said that in reverse, all tires were spinning, you couldn't hold one at all. In a truck, usually reverse is your lowest gear, I wonder if the same is true on the 'Cat's, or if it's the way the diff is setup?
Anyway, good post, let us know how the front end goes, what you think of it when you're done too. Hey, post some new pics when finished, if you get the chance too, I'd like to see it with all the new improvements. Oh, I think it would be wise to change both sets of bearings up front as well, since you'll be in there doing the left side anyway, might as well do the right. That way you know for sure they're both in good shape, and you won't end up with uneven wear, end up having to re-do the right side a month or two later.
Mike
Posted by: cowboy
I think what Andy means is that the higher pressures make it ride more rough generally speaking. You know, like in car or truck tires, when the pressures are higher, you "feel" all the little potholes or divots in the road more because there is less of a "air cussion" there. When I had my 'Claws mounted the pressures were varying between 9-13 lbs. in all four tires. -And we pay these guys for mounting??? You'd think they'd be able to get the pressure at least the same in all four tires, even if they can't get it at the recommended p.s.i. Anyway, I dropped them all to 9 lbs., and man, it rode like a rock! Now, I'm running 6.5 lbs. up front (to equate for the weight up there) and 6 lbs. in the rear. This balances out pretty well and it's MUCH smoother riding.
Sounds to me though like your tie rod needs adjustment???? That would probably cause the bounce you are speaking of. More of a shimy maybe? My truck was out when I put the lift on it, and man, that thing rode terrible, shaking, vibrating back and forth till I adjusted the tie rod, then it was great.
Best of luck, let us know how the race goes, sounds like The_Law has one awesome machine there!, definately be interesting. Hey, did you ever get to race that guy with the Ruby yet???
Mike
Posted by: cowboy
Ah, I hear ya now. Best of luck getting those bolts to break loose though, some of them are a real pain in the butt! I can't believe how hard it was to break loose the two main bolts for the rear rack, when installing the rear bumper. Man, kept slipping the socket off, and actually broke the ratchet part in the process! It was a little rusty though, so that's probably the problem there. Gotta love Crafstman though, guaranteed for life! Anyway, had to switch to an end wrench, with a cheater bar! When they finally broke, I thought I'd popped the head clean off. Luckily the bolt had broke loose, and was still in good shape.
As for that guy with the Ruby-only 4 miles! Man, what's it do, just sit there and look pretty? Must be nice to have that kind of money to buy things just to look at.
Good luck with the project, let us know how the race goes!
Mike
Posted by: cowboy
Damn Boner, sounds like my day yesterday-one thing right after another, and a real pain in the butt, yet kind of fun at the same time. Well, I must say my little river voyage was not fun at all, but the earlier riding/coyote hunting was a blast. At least you got a good connection there by the sounds of things with that guy.
Hey, got a question for you though-I didn't get a chance to check the 'Cat out thoroughly yet, but did look at a few things. I found no traceable evidence of water in either the airbox or intake, or the oil at all. However, when trying to start it up, it doesn't want to start very well at all, when it does, you have to keep the choke on all the way, and give it throttle to keep it running, otherwise it dies. I tried to drive it off the trailer into the garage, and it kept dying on me when trying to do this. The only way it would run was with the choke on all the way, and about half throttle. Does this sound like water in the carbuerator to you? Tomorrow I'm going to dig into things a little deeper, change the oil and filter just for good measure, drain the gas tank and fill with fresh gas, as well as a heat gas treatment stuff, and check or change the spark plug. You think that will fix my problem, or could there be something else wrong?
By the way it's acting, I'm guessing it's water in the gas, does that sound right? Have you ever had anything like that happen in all those deep mud rides you do?
Thanks for the help,
Mike
Posted by: cowboy
I'm on it tomorrow for sure. Was going to tear into it today, but was conned into going duck hunting instead. Should have just stayed home and worked on the 'Cat, it definately would have been more productive.
Boner:
I've never looked into a carb before, so I'm completely ignorant of that entire area. Do I need to pull it out, or just a piece of it? Should I do anything about the carb vent lines? I was going to pull both side panels off, and take the gas tank out as well, also take a look into the spark plug to see if it's firing properly. It acts like water, but if the plug is fouled, it might not be starting very well either. Do you think after I put in all fresh gas, that I should put in some Heat stuff? I thought that would help get anything out of the lines, is that a good idea or not? Also, if the plug is black, that is an idication it is running too rich isn't it? Or do I have that backwards? If this is the case, is the jet easy to replace? Minehunter had written that he recently installed a different jet, and it seemed to run better-I think he had a black plug if I remember right. I'm guessing mine will be too, as when I pulled out the stock plug and installed the cre8, I think it was a little on the dark side. Does the dealer have extra jets, or is that an order piece, and if so, should I go with a stock jet replacement of a different size, or go with a dynojet kit? I remember you saying something once about one of the jet kits that they charge $50+ for you could get for only a few dollars someplace else?
Anyway, sorry for all the questions, I just want to make sure I get it all done right, and don't screw anything up.
Thanks for the help!
Mike
Posted by: cowboy
Matty:
Hey, just got back from the dealer with a bunch of oil, filters, the works. Will be tearing into it shortly. Plan on pulling both side panels off, the gas tank, etc., then pulling the carb apart-to the best of what I'm brave enough to try anyway! I'll try to catch the contents like Boner suggested to see what's in there in a clear jar, as well as check the oil when I change it.
As for the plug, the cre8 is a colder plug actually. I had the 6 in stock, but a bunch of guys recommended changing to an 8 shortly after I bought it, so I tried it, and have been pleased with it so far. I'm not sure I'll be changing the jet just yet. I'll take a look at the plug to see how it looks, then decide on a possible change or not. I'm hoping I don't have to, as I don't know anything about carbs, so I'd probably get myself into trouble with that one. Definately don't need that.
Anyway, thanks for the tips, I think I'll go start on it now.
Take care,
Mike
Posted by: cowboy
My stock plug was a 6 as well. I switched to the 8 due to some advice from several guys on here, and did notice a slight power gain in doing so. So, should I put an 8 back in now, or go with a 7??? I believe the 7 used to be the standard plug, from what my dealer was saying, until they bumped it up to the 6 in '98 he thought. I was going to change the plug as well, but forgot to buy that for some damn reason-it was on my list with oil and filter, somehow forgot it.
Anyway, Boner, you were right, my carb was full of water. I took it out of the machine, then pulled the top gold colored cover off, figured that was wrong, so I put it back together. Then, pulled the smaller triangle plate with 3 screws in it off, had some water fall out of it, wasn't sure if that was the right place or not, so I put it back together. Then, I pulled the thing nearly in half, ended up stopping mid way though, and put it back together as well. Like I said, I don't know jack about carbs, so I was getting a little worried about what I should and should not be messing with. When done messing around, I put it back together.
I also took the tranny cover off, the side of the tranny as well. Belt looked great, just like new, but there was about an inch or so of water in the entire bottom of the housing. That would explain the motor running, and the machine not moving very well-belt slippage for sure here and also, the very first time ever.
Also, changed the oil and while I didn't find much, there was a traceable amount of water in there as well. The plug was black when I pulled it out, but like I said, I'll be putting the new one in tomorrow after I make a special trip just for it, as like an idiot, I forgot today. Also cleaned the air filter real well, drained the gas tank and installed some heat in with the fresh tank. After putting everything all back together, I just let it set. The air filter isn't dry yet, so I'll wait and try to start it tomorrow after the new plug goes in. Oh, changed the oil filter as well.
Is there a specific reason the carb vent line is located so low on the engine? I can see how the water easily made it's way up in there, so I re-located it up above, closer to the air intake, but kept it turned down just for good measure. Oh, also cleaned and put some oil near/in the steering column/bushings like you recommended, to prevent any possible squeaks later on.
Anything else you can think of before I start her up tomorrow?
Thanks again for the advice!
Mike
Posted by: cowboy
Boner:
Thanks for the replies, wish I would have seen them earlier today! The bit about the manual is my problem-see, I normally keep it in that space in the bottom of the seat in a zip-lock bag, that way it's always there should I need it in case of an emergency sometime. Well, I went to grab it, and it's not there. For the life of me, I can't seem to find it anywhere.
As for your directions, that's pretty much exactly what I did. I drained the oil first, then just left the plug out. Then, pulled the old oil filter, put the new one on. Next, took apart the tranny and drained it, left that plug out, and the outer case off. Then, pulled the gas tank off, and pulled the carb up and out through the top. I played with both the top and bottom, but didn't adjust any screws on it at all. Hey, what is that black cable/wire thing that has a nob attached to it on the bottom right side of the carb? It's about 3-4" long or so, and has a knob of some kind on it, looks like you would turn it to adjust something??? Like I said, I can't find my manual anywhere and don't know where my dad put his, so I can't exactly look it up.
Anyway, I put most of it back together, with the exception of the side panels and airbox. I'm going to change plugs tomorrow, and have also been re-wiring my reverse lights, and mounting a different switch in a new location. After I get that stuff done, I'll fire it up, see how she sounds.
Anyway, thanks again for the info, sorry to bother you so much lately!
Mike
Posted by: TheLaw
Well, seeing has how you think I will get smoked from what you hear.....I guess I may as well not show up. Boner you also forgot my cam, HL Daylight Kit, and whatever else...I dont remember anymore. With only a Cam and Power Kit for power...and still having 25/26 Biclaws, I would eat a Recon alive in a drag race from gears 2-5. Well seeing has how I would be even quicker just from the tires, I forgot to mention the power boost from the head work and Big Bore Kit.......So I guess that still makes me slow?
Posted by: girthyguy
I think because of your lift didnt you loose some wheel base. This will probably answer why you wheelied so easly. I know my cousin Has built blaster that he lengthend the swing arm just 2 inches and that made a world of differance with the fron end coming up. I know you wheel base wouldnt have changed that much but it might be just enough to affect it.
matty
Posted by: girthyguy
Cowboy, sounds like you do have water in your gas. Did you drain all of your gas out, after you lost it in the river? Or did you put any heat or any other gas aditives to take the water out. i wouldnt let it sit to long with the water on the tank. I did that with mine. I only had crappy gas but up here in Wi with the cold weather, The carb ended up building alot of varnish. so I had to tear that apart and cleen it out. You probably wont have to do that at all, I was just gone for 2 weeks so that cat just sat there. Well best of luck for you.
matty
Posted by: girthyguy
Cowboy,
Is there a reason why you put a different plug in. Mine has cre6. You have to watch it when you do that. If you put to hot of plug( I forgot is it higher the # the hotter the plug or is it the other way around I always forget) you have a good chance of burning a hole in your piston. When you change jets just becareful Sometimes they become a pain in the @$$. You live in the moutians right. So your jets will be different then us flat landers. I would if i where you talk to your local dealer and see what his mechanic recomends for jets. Best of luck
matty
Posted by: girthyguy
Dont look at the plug thats in it right now to take a correct reading. I presume you got a new plug right away too. I would put that in, an put a few miles on it then look at it. because right now it will most likely look dark since all of the water and gook. But sounds like you have some fun a head of you. good luck
matty
Posted by: girthyguy
Really you lost that much top end. How fast does yours go, according to the stock speedo. Mine will hit 53-55. I to have the 99 i still Have my stock 26". Maybe the cre8 would be worth the try
matty
Posted by: girthyguy
Boner,
Your right about the throttle cable. Its usually a pretty standard thing to do, because the cables always stretch. Its like if you by a new bicycle they always recomend you bring it back in after so many miles so the can adjust the cables do to stretching. There is one thing about AC from all of the years riding there snowmobiles, ac is the worst out of box sled. But with a little bit of dialing up the clutches and rejetting the carbs you cant beat an AC. I havent really tinkered with the fourwheeler performance wise. But I bet with a little work it will surprise you. Atleast thats the way there sleds are.
matty
Posted by: YukonRon
Boner:
How many miles do you have on your bike? I didn't think it was that old, so I was surprised to hear that you are already changing brakes and bearings.
Do you think the bigger tires could have contributed to the bearing wear?
Posted by: ROMAN
Yeah that handle bar tremor sure sounds like bad tie-rod adjustment to me. My quadzilla used to do that and feel like it was going to throw my hands off the bar especially when I let off the gas. I inspected the front end and all looked good and I couldn't understand it. One day on the stand I noticed that the inner tie-rod where it bolts to the steering stem had wobbled the hole out. Allowing the wheel to drift back and forth when it was rolling but act normal when you would try to shake it by hand. I drilled it and put a bushing in it. No problem since. I run alot of tire pressure, too. Just trying to get alittle extra ground clearance on the Prairie.
Posted by: ROMAN
Yeah they're tough. I had to flip my wheeler up on the grab-bar and go-to-town on them jokers.
They weren't pretty when they finally came off.
Soak 'em awhile and if that don't work heat 'em.
good vice-grips and a big hammer and a pissed attitude will get 'em off.
