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Posted by: Dill
I suggest we all sent Mr. Niskanen a nice polite, but firm email stating our points, and the fact that he doesn't seem to have ever ridden with a responsible person. his email is cniskanen@pioneerpress.com
Posted by: P.J.
Most "nature loving liberals" are not really all that interested in nature.....their primary objective is to change your behavior. Because they don't engage in an activity, they believe you shouldn't be allowed to either. Your correct....the economics, the majority and the real impact suggest that this public resource is being used properly. Unfortunately, the noisy minority makes more noise at times and has access to the liberal media as a mouthpiece. That's why it is SO IMPORTANT that you (and everybody else reading this) join organizations which support your interests and has a lobbying presence in politics.....and get your friends to do the same. Call your representatives and tell them the real story and state your opinions. Don't expect someone else to do your job.....the noisy liberal minority is well organized and will eat our lunch.
Posted by: dual-sporter
how many of you that live in the area have written the editor of this newspaper regarding his open bias????
Posted by: Thor
http://www.pioneerplanet.com/columnists/docs/NISKANEN/docs/021770.htm
Here we go again: Chris Niskanen once again attacks atvs in the Sunday Sports Section of the Pioneer Press.
"Disrupting the solitude of the forest" for those who go there for peace and tranquility.
I just completed a 160 mile weekend ride over the weekend. I did not see ANY cross country skiers, snowshoers, hikers or tranquility lovers on any roads or trails. But I did see hundreds of Snowmobiles and ATVs.
These outdoor activists were buying food in restaurants, gas at convenience stores and renting motel rooms. In other words, it was motorized vehicles which ride on trails generating the income for the areas in which I was riding.
If there were no internal combustion engines out on the trails in the forests that I was in, the area would be dotted with ghost towns.
I understand that Alaska and the Yukon are still desolate, perhaps these purists should move there. But chances are that there are probably more snowmobiles and ATVs per capita than there are in Minnesota and the rest of the country. Your thoughts?
Posted by: Thor
350s for sale? Not off Hand.
The outdoor sports writer for the St. Paul Pioneer Press is at it again. He dislikes any type of motorized devices in the outdoors.
He is always subtly spinning negative tales about ATVs and Snowmobiles which have registrations in the state of over 400,000. Yet he fills up the back of the sports page in the paper about skijoring with dogs. An event which attracted 57 people statewide.
I seriously wonder if the man is in touch with reality. He is certainly euphorian.
When he does write about pheasant hunting or duck hunting it is never at public shooting grounds but always as a guest of a preserve or private hunting club.
When Mr. Niskanen writes his annual story about Grouse Hunting, he always says his hunting was interrupted by boorish people on ATVs.
He never mentions deer hunting and if he does, again it is on private property as a guest of an old family homestead which limits out every year.
Only on rare occasion does he write an article about ice-fishing at the beginning of the season.
When he does, he is the guest of a local guide searching for publicity.
Oh... I almost forgot, he is also against electronic fishing devices.
His common thread is: If it has a motor and it involves the forest/lakes/rivers/electronics, he is against it.
Posted by: Thor
Thank you for your input. Sounds like you have camped out at the state park at the south end of Lake Mille Lacs (or was it the other campground down on 27)
>>>thought his article was pretty reasonable.
You are kidding right?
The writer does have literary skills and can sway opinions if you do not know that he has an agenda.
>>>>The problem is there are a lot of irresponsible riders. (dirt bikes, and other vehicles with loud and obnoxious pipes)
It is part of the price of freedom. We cannot legislate common sense or courtesy, nor can we put our heads in the sand and totally ignore it either.
As far as tar paths next to the Red Top Trail I believe that they are in Isle aren't they? South of the State Park.
I have also ridden the area and found none of the abuses which you claim. Sleepless nights, piles of trash and the like in this area.
The most trash that I have ever seen, is along the bicycle/roller-blade path that runs through Moose Lake. In fact I have never seen so many Granola bar wrappers and water bottles of every shape and description strewn into the bushes along this motorless path.
Litter prone people come from all walks of life not only the ranks of ATV riders.
Perhaps we are talking about two or three different areas?
Posted by: Thor
Is the Spider Lake area an "unofficial camping/riding area?" I have seen this in areas north of Mille Lacs.
The DNR does not prohibit the camping/riding but does not officially sanction it and provide trash barrels, because if they did it would be recognized as an official recreation area and trash pick-up would be required. Sort of a catch 22.
It is very unfortunate that some people cannot haul out or bury/burn their garbage when they abandon a campsite.
Posted by: Thor
I sent my letter
Posted by: Thor
I did.
Posted by: tenney
I thought his article was pretty reasonable. The problem is there are a lot of irresponsible riders. I mainly ride the redtop and spider like trails in central Minnesota. I am absolulty amazed at the behavior I see. Most people don't wear helmets and have no concerns for other riders or the enviroment. I see very young children riding around on sportsmans, usually riding double with no saftey equipment. Campsites have been closed because so much trash is being left behind. You can't enjoy a good night sleep because of the couple morons who ride all night. The last time I went I was very irritated by the noise. In this case it was mostly dirt bikes that kept going by our campsite over and over. We were next to the beach where it clearly says NO ATVS. I can't count how many times people ripped it up. At the redtop there is a tar bike path that runs along part of the ripped up rail road tracks. Actually goes in the oppisite direction of the good trails, but it has a dirt trail along side it for atvs. Well I made the mistake of trying to do some inline skating after trail riding. People flew by kicking up dust, even tho it clearly states to slow down! Not only that I can't count how many times some groups would be driving on the tar!!!! Why would you take your ATV on tar??? Because of this the tar was littered with dirt and stones making it impossible to skate. I agree in most places I ride I see nothing but offroad vehicles. I think either we need to be more responsible or we will slowly lose our trails. Due to the things I have seen I couldn't really argue with closing some trails. I have seen it first hand and could only argue that some of us do ride responsibly. Sorry for the rambling I am just very concered about losing the trails.
Posted by: tenney
I havn't actually camped in Isle. My only problem there is with the bike path. It is more a problem at spider lake. It is in the Motley area, your campgrounds are on the trail. I have no problem with noisy bikes, in fact my 400ex is piped. I realize my bike is noisy so I don't drive it in the middle of the night. DNR has closed camp sites because of trash being left behind at spider lake. These sites are only used by atvers/dirt bikes.
The trails themselves are very clean. It is more of a campsite problem. And your right this happens anywhere camping occurs. But it sure looks bad when sites used by atvers are all trashed.
I have never seen an article from this guy before. All I know is I have been quite annoyed by my fellow riders at times, so it is no doubt others not affiliated with the sport would be also.
Posted by: tenney
"Spider Lake Foot Hills State Forest" is actually an official riding area. It is one of the best spots I have found in Minnesota for a sport bike. Lots of sand pits etc. I like it because you can camp on the trail. What is also great is the trails are open to trucks/jeeps. My truck likes to get dirty too. If you goto the DNR website it is on their maps.
Posted by: Diogenes
>>>>The problem is there are a lot of irresponsible riders. (dirt bikes, and other vehicles with loud and obnoxious pipes)
"It is part of the price of freedom."
Responsibility comes with freedom, Thor.
While I hope you obtain additional ATV trails in MN, tolerating misbehavior from even a few off-road riders won't improve your chances of success in my opinion.
What can you do? Certainly, don't provoke a confrontation; however, you and other ATVers and ATV clubs can exercise some leadership regarding safe (as in helmets and riding practices) and responsible (as in no noise and other pollution, no trail damage) riding, and in supporting fair enforcement.
Denial of misbehavior by some off-road riders plays into ATV critics' hands; they've probably seen and heard some for themselves. Instead, sell the responsible and considerate behavior of the majority of ATVers.
Good luck with the new trails initiative in MN. If you write a letter to the editor, stick to the issues, do not attack the editorial writer personally (for example, regarding his elite hunting opportunities). While more objectivity might be hoped for in a news article, he's entitled to express his opinion in a signed editorial column.
Diogenes
Posted by: hrc200x
Thor, maybe you should write him a letter and tell him what you think. I am going to college in Hibbing, MN and people drive their 3 and 4 wheelers all over the place up here. Right down steets even. There is also a lot of old mining roads to go on.
Do you know of any 350x's for sale?
'85 200x
'86 350x
2 '85 350x bare frames
Posted by: rippenbanshee
You guys better get off your butts and get rid of this guy. I already know you Mn. people have a tough jetski law in effect for all your lakes.
Here is a little suggestion, if a few of you quad owners went out and spent $30.00 on 500 flyers for each of you and you handed them out to all the emplyees and workers of all these hotels,restaraunts, gas stations, ect, ect of these small towns that depend on quads and rec vehicles for a living. Then a few of you went to these manufactures that make these quads and tell them that their job is in jepordy because of some
writer for a paper.
Have all these people call the editor of the paper and voice their opinion. It might work.
Right now jet ski sales are at an all time low because of all the Enviro Nazis. The same could
happen to quads.
We have the same problem in Florida but we go and
fight for our rights.
I wish all Mn.& Wi. luck in kicking some Enviro Nazi BUTT..
