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Posted by: sam
First I want to thank all in the service now and in the past my family and I owe you or gratitude(sp) Thank you. IMO I think alot of dems have been pulled way to the left and out of main stream. if it wasnt for the media proping them up, there days would be numberd. I just wish the republicans would fight back like the dems fight to get there way. the way I look at it if the rich cant get richer (with out breaking the law)I dont have a job. Ive never had a job by a poor person. also you will never get a tax break from any of these dems running now. they all want to raise our taxis and cut our military.
Sam
Posted by: HoundDog06
I don't mean to sound condescending but don't you guys think you are a little behind? We have been debating this issue for the last six months with several threads over five pages long. I was just curious why you have waited till now when its all but over with kerry receiving the nomination to bring this up...
Just curious. For more information on this subject and several good viewpoints, check out this thread.
~HoundDog
Posted by: lv2ride
While I can understand the frustration that political issues can cause, I've got to say, if there was as much effort to fight for our access and use of public lands equal to some of the rants in this thread, we'd have some pretty good access! The thing is, if we just point fingers at each other, then nothing gets done. We need to stop defending the bad ideas, the poor policies of one person or group just because they are part of the package. We NEED put some effort into understanding the reasons we are getting shut out, and work to change them whether they be policy, or people (political or fellow riders). In the end, politicians are just embodied empty promises that leave office after a few years. We need to get the policies in place that will give us the opportunity to give our future generations a place to enjoy that won't be taken from them. Politicians are just the unfortunate middle men (or women) that we have to go through to convey our ideas.
There are plenty of other issues that we have to be aware of sure, but these forums are places to offer ideas and concerns about our favorite sport.
Posted by: garyc660R
I agree with that Alaskaboy!
Posted by: garyc660R
Quote
Originally posted by: KGB
Get off your butt and VOTE!
The general public's vote for president means nothing.
Posted by: garyc660R
Quote
Originally posted by: KGB
Gary, I respect you alot, but why would you try to get people not to vote? I can't respect that, no matter what your reasoning is.
Don't get me wrong....we need everyone too vote and have the people in place that WE ALL want....everywhere but the presidency anyways. The general public's vote for president means nothing....well it means that is the general publics opinion. Electoral votes are what elects a president. WHat does this mean? Obviously, the general public is perceived as being too dumb too properly elect a president. Later gentlemen.
Posted by: Raptoryfn660r
2003--1040
Line 9b: Qualified Dividends
One word: Incredible
Posted by: Raptoryfn660r
If you have dividend producing stocks that are eligible, the dividends are not taxed as ordinary income but at different rates going by your income level.
I am going to use the lower scale at the 5% tax rate for reference. You have income of $100.00 that came from stock XYZ that is eligible, in the past you were taxed on the full amount just as if it were earned income. For the next 4 years you will only be taxed on $5.00 out of that $100.00, 95.00 is tax free.
At some point the money that is not taxed is going to show up back in the economy as returned investment or the money will be spent on goods and services.
Myself, I will be investing long term back into the stock market.
Posted by: Bing
i think all US citizens should vote!! Mandatory, or you get taxed at a slightly higher rate,,,,same with military service.
Posted by: KGB
Problem is :
Only a small percentage of Americans actually vote. A smaller percentage of young Americans vote.
You can not find a candidate to take care of all you needs. that would be a perfect world, we are far from that. I use to be inder this illusion.
Bush is by far the best candidate for me and most like minded people.
My reasons:
1) He will go after the terrorists, no one else will. He might be doing it for other reasons than you or I think he should, but the fact remains, he is hunting those bastards down. Not waiting for them to come here.
2) He believes Regan and JFK had the right idea about the economy: Give the people their money back and let the ecomony grow, its working.
3) He is willing to explore our own land to find energy sources so we can become less reliant on the middle east. Its not up for debate that the landscape suffers from drilling and exploration, its just that the Dems want other countries to have those problems, not us. Was that clear? Bush also granted the auto makers alot of $$$ for alternative fuel vehicles.
4) I support his admin. not signing the Kyoto treaty, they have got some heat for it, but only by close minded ignorant fools, who do not understand that Kyoto allows India and other countries to actually increase their pollution out put.
I do have issues with alot of his policies, but I am not a immigrant, my job is not in jeopardy of being taken by a immigrant. I am concearned about deficit, but what do you do? You can't support the war on terror, but expect it to be free. There are more, those are just two examples.
Every one must weigh the issues that pertaint to hem the most, and see what candidate will do the best for them.
Get off your butt and VOTE!
Posted by: KGB
Gary, I respect you alot, but why would you try to get people not to vote?
I can't respect that, no matter what your reasoning is.
Posted by: KGB
Gary,
I know what you meant. Thansk for clarifing though! I am just worried about some body reading it and thinking they should not vote.
GO VOTE!
Posted by: generallee
Howard Dean Bites
Posted by: RookWV
Kerry's a tree huggin bunny lover too: http://www.issues2000.org/Domestic/John_Kerry_Environment.htm
Posted by: twentycharacters
dean sucks. Kerry is just as bad- go look at his website and download the 20 PAGE report that he wants to do with the environment. He hasnt made this public. He wants to undo everything the Bush admin did in regards to the enviroment. This is very BAD news. This means land closures and even to the point RESTRICTING YOU on your OWN land! dont belive me? read his 20 PAGE report detailing this.
He promises to enact it during his first 100 days in office. Oh yes its true, he is a radical and makes me sick! If he gets in, the second age of ATVS will be ending again. we cannot let him get in. Go out and vote like you have never voted before. Whether you like BUSH or not. you have to ask yourself," do I want to ride? Do I want to have places to ride?" If you answer YES to these then go VOTE FOR BUSH and DONT LET KERRY get in! RISE UP and lobby against him. When you RISE up- you stand up for your RIGHT TO RIDE!!!
Posted by: twentycharacters
Quote
We went from almost NO debt to 7 Trillion dallors in debt
This is not true. We have had a DEBT for a long time. I think since the end of WW2. Deficits were slashed during the Clinton years as a reasult of MILITARY spending cuts -and leaving us as a sitting duck. Debt and deficit are 2 different things. DEFICIT is the shortfall of planned budgeting. DEBT is the accumulation. There is no way that BUSH got us in over 7 TRILLION dollars in 3 years. Furthermore, the 'SURPLUS' that CLINTON projected during his last year in office NEVER EXISTED. It was all pretty PROJECTIONS IF the economy were to grow at the pace it was growing every year for the next 10-15 years. There was never ANY money in the bank. IT was all speculation, projection. Do I blame CLinton? NO. Given the data at the time, I would have projected the same thing. BUT, If you knew anything about economics, you would understand that recession is a natural cycle of the economy. It is not Bush's fault and its not Clintons fault. But alot of people give Clinton credit for the 90's boom. Hey, it was a 'right place right time' scenerio. Technology was coming of age. He was in office. Perfect timing.
The record shows that during the last quarter of the first Bush, the economy was recovering. It stayed recovering until the LAST quarter of CLINTON. Yes, it was in a decline when Clinton left office. Bush came in, and inherited the downturn, the normal cycle of the economy. And all of a sudden it's his fault. what a load of crap! NINE months after BUSH got in, the attack on America happened. What you you have done if you were him? He had to re-adjust his priorities to protect America and that's what he did. What would AL Gore have done? he would have bent over and not done anything. ANd the economy would have had the SAME downturn.
THe President is not elected to create jobs. He is elected to uphold the Constitution of the United States of America and to protect it and the people in it. He is not WALMART, he is not an employer. EVERY 'nay sayer' acts like BUSH got in office and maliciously FIRED 3.5 MILLION people. That is not even close to the truth. The truth is that the economy has suffered more to corporate scandals than anything BUSH has done. I tell you what, last year was the FIRST year I have ever gotten any tax back. I am not one of the richest 1%. I am middle class at best. The tax cut definitely helped me and my family and millions of others. The tax cuts are necessary so stop listening to the democrats who dont care about you - they just act like it. They dont want tax cuts b/c they want gov programs and stuff and want to line their pockets with the money skimmed from programs. Do the research - there have been WAY more scandals with democrats than with Republicans.
But if you are a rider, which this is a riding forum, you will NOT want o vote for Kerry b/c he hates ATVs and wants to stop them and keep them off of any property. even your own.
Posted by: twentycharacters
I am not a soldier and cannot even pretend to understand what kind of hell you have seen, but I truly salute you and just would like to say thank you for serving/protecting America, SSG Dean G!
Posted by: twentycharacters
Quote
So by coming down hard on the top 1% you are coming down hard on me and my family
no one is coming down on you. the democrats lump this together. i was was just repeating it for sarcasm.
im glad you worked hard and make a good living - i wish that for everyone. truth is that democrats think that if you make x number of dollars they lump you into that category as the richest 1% and want to tax the carp out of you. its basically a punishment for working hard and earning more than others. i think its bullcrap. im not trying to politsize this but hey- if we sit back and do nothing and vote this guy kerry in- then we are screwing ourselves. b/c there will be no place to ride, the industry will dry up again. ther is no way not to politisize this because this election will effect us all.
Posted by: twentycharacters
did anyone see the ozzy thing about ATVs on the news tonight? if you think its BS, give me a hell yeah! and also go here and tell them intelligently what you think:
primetime email
Posted by: trailrider500
Anyone that votes democRAT is a#####.. This country has gone to he!! the things we let people get by with.. I will stop here otherwise i might get removed...
Posted by: Just4Kicks
Quote
Originally posted by: deanz400
ey bottom line people the general knowledge is that most if not all liberals or democrats want to take our riding rights away and in general you can blame who you want but the out right knowledge is republicans want smaller gov. ( ie less taxes ) and the democrates just want you to give them your money ,so they can invest it in welfare systems , so they have a voter base they can control. if you want to know the average americans , or the welthy anyone making over 60,000 a year thats what the democrates say is welthy , pay like 92% of the tax base of this country and the top 1%earners pay over 50% of the tax base . the republicans are the only party that is trying to give some thing back to the general population.not just the welfare recipiants . hey spudss you want 3rd world why don't you join a military service and have them send you to iraq . thats where i am right now and if you think a 3rd world nation is so great you should see what a leader like saddam did to a country that had more free welth then many and what kind of abject poverty these people live in . when's the last time you lived in a mud block hut with a dirt floor ,you should try it .it's not pretty .
sincerely SSG Dean G.
H*LL YES!! Well said and I couldn't agree with you more.
Posted by: Just4Kicks
BTW, for anyone using the words "top 1% of income earners" and "rich" in the same sentence I would recommend you get the facts straight. My household income puts me in the top 1% of earners and I am by no means "rich" I can assure you. The problem with a general classification like that is that the top 1% is an extremely broad range of income. I'm not a movie star or a professional sports or media figure and I don't develop software. I may be in the top 1% but I doubt I would be welcome at the same country club as the "real rich" people. So by coming down hard on the top 1% you are coming down hard on me and my family. I live pretty well compared to most I suppose but d@mn it I deserve it! And guess what, I put it back into the economy every time I make a purchase, hire someone to do a job for me, or make a charitable donation. And if you think only blue collar workers are the ones busting their a$$ then I have news for you...I used to dig ditches with a shovel and I come from an entire family of blue collar workers. I then went to college full-time (paid for entirely by me) while working full-time and driving over 100 miles a day almost 7-days a week. My marriage sucked and I owned my first home that I had no time to enjoy but I was determined so I did it. Now I hear somebody telling me that I don't deserve what I have or that I should pay more taxes because I am privelidged. If I want to lower my standard of living so that everything I have worked for and sacrificed can go to the aid of others who in my opinion, don't deserve it, then I guess I'll vote Democrat. But that will never happen!
Posted by: Just4Kicks
Quote
Originally posted by: AlaskaBoy
After reading the quote posted by just4kicks I learned that I am wealthy and here I thought we were just getting by, how stupid of me. I can't wait to tell the wife that we are wealthy.
Welfare shouls be limited to a max of 1 year, then get your a@# back to work, McDonalds is always hiring. AlaskaBoy.
Pretty ridiculous classification don't you think? I believe the top 1% of earners or the so-called rich are over 100K a year. If that has changed recently someone please let me know. Gee, I guess I'm about as well off as Bill Gates. LOL!!
Posted by: Just4Kicks
Quote
Originally posted by: twentycharacters
Quote
So by coming down hard on the top 1% you are coming down hard on me and my family
no one is coming down on you. the democrats lump this together. i was was just repeating it for sarcasm.
im glad you worked hard and make a good living - i wish that for everyone. truth is that democrats think that if you make x number of dollars they lump you into that category as the richest 1% and want to tax the carp out of you. its basically a punishment for working hard and earning more than others. i think its bullcrap. im not trying to politsize this but hey- if we sit back and do nothing and vote this guy kerry in- then we are screwing ourselves. b/c there will be no place to ride, the industry will dry up again. ther is no way not to politisize this because this election will effect us all.
I know you were not coming down on me, I didn't word that well...sorry. I just wanted to make a point to those who don't know that the top 1% of earners are not necessarily rich. It's a phrase the Democrats love to use "wealthiest 1%" to make voters believe that taxing the cr@p out of hard working people like myself is somehow justified. As you well know, it is not.
As for Kerry and our right to ride....I sincerely hope no body comes on the forum crying that their riding area is being shut down if they cast a vote for Kerry.
Posted by: WoodsRuner
Not just Democraps, Liberals think that way. Can be any party.
Liberals think they have all the rights and we, the common people,
have none.
Posted by: WoodsRuner
HoundDog, this is the first I have seen any of it. Guess I wasn't paying attention.
Posted by: WoodsRuner
If you had $300 million in personal wealth, and you didn't want to get caught, believe me no one could
catch you. BushyBoy is doing a pretty good job, IMHO. At least he had the gonads to go after those
idiots. Economy is coming back, taxes are lower, my IRA is bigger, and Hussien is captured. Bush has
absolutely nothing to do with rising medical costs, that is a private enterprise. And socialized medicine
is a joke, we DON'T want it here.
Posted by: WoodsRuner
No I do not agree the moon base is a waste of money, nor the planned trip to Mars.
Every dollar NASA spends on new projects like this returns 17 dollars in new taxes. It
is a fact, look it up. We need to explore space, for the knowledge, for the advances
in technology, for the sake of exploration, for the natural resources. If we don't do it, ]
no one will. Look at what Kennedy's moon project did for these.
The IRA increases are a direct result of Bush's 2 tax relief packages. It was in them. Read
them. He and Congress increased the amounts we can put in an IRA every years and get a
tax break on. Greenspan had nothing to do with it. If you noticed, Greenspan has been cutting
interest rates for 4 1/2 years, and it did not turn the economy around. Tax breaks, the return of
confidence by the people and companies, and renewed investment is what turned it around.
Without the tax cuts, the other two would not have happened.
We need to keep government OUT of things like health care. The problem always gets worse
when governments get into the act.
Posted by: Spudss
For one bush couldnt even run his own loan and fianance company did daddy had to pass laws to keep him out of the pen....We went from almost NO debt to 7 Trillion dallors in debt... How is a moon station going to help the figure... It WONT If you want to blow your hard earned money on the crap thats your choice.. Your probably in the oil buissness and getting kick backs from all the taxes bush pass for the RICH... As for the middle class that bust our A$$ day in and day out IM GETTING RACKED by bush... If hes in office another 4 years we all might as well move to a 3rd world country because it will be better than this place..Thats where all our jobs are any way....
Posted by: Spudss
HEY (Howard)Deanz400...I served my time in the Army from 95'-01' So I know what a 3rd world country looks like...Ive been there and done that ....I am saying with all the guttless polititions making jacked up laws just to get there name in a book for passing somthing...This country is going down hill they have taken all the morals this nation was founded from and throwing them away....god made adam and eve not adam and steve..Thats just one example now my kids cant pledge the flag that I served to protect!!!!!!!!What is our President doing to protect our rights??? There all liars and will do what ever it take to get into office then were on our own....The only President that really cared about his countryman was Abe
Posted by: Spudss
Deanz400,
I couldnt agree with you more...Thats what I was talking about.....Kerry is the biggest tree hugging clown Ive seen in a while (since Al Gore) Our great Nation is getting destroyed from within...Idiotic people are killing us...
Posted by: fidge1
thats typicla from a democrat.... All democrats think that way
Posted by: fidge1
i agree woodsrunner
Posted by: AlaskaBoy
I would not worry about Dean as he is pulling out of the race as for Kerry I am not sure where he stands. Bush is another story, I could see him doing anything to get reelected, I am not sure we can afford another 4 years of him.
Remember his pledge to get Ossama, well I have less rights now and he is enjoying his freedom giving us the old bird. What about the Moon base, I do not give a rats a@@ about that. I want the rising medical costs taken care of and not rebuilding Iraq for them to just take back and go back to the way they were. My rant. AlaskaBoy.
Posted by: AlaskaBoy
WoodsRunner, I did not say Bush was the reason of rising healthcost, but he is one of the reasons it is not fixed. With the republicans getting so much kick backs and yes the dems too to keep them from regulating healthcosts. Did you know that our country is the only country that allows the pharmecutical(spelling bad) to recoup the R&D costs for all drugs it makes and sells, so we have to pay for all the other countries cheap drugs as they can only charge the cost of making that single pill in Canada and Mexico and so forth. Then you have the doctors who can't stay in business because their malpractice insurance keeps going up, medicine is a learning game, there will always be new procedures and yes they will have risk but because somebody chooses this route and dies, does this mean that they should get sued (doctors) for hundred's of millions of dollars. It is up to the govt to put some limits out there but alass that will not happen as they get kick backs from the lawyers who bring up these frivlous lawsuits. Bush is not the reason your IRA is going up, you can thank Greenspan for that and he has been there since the creation of dirt. As for taxes, that will not last as we keep spending like we do, the tax sunset clause is fast approaching and their is alot of congressmen, rep and dems who are in favor of letting it set and not renew, so their goes your tax breaks. The economy is also do to Greenspan, but how long can we go with the interest rates at 1%. I agree with you on the socialized medicine, that will just cost too much and it does limit what procedures can be done when you need them. What is needed is TORT reform laws that work, there is the cases were there is negligience, but to to go after and win millions and even billions of dollars for an honest mistake just keeps driving up health cost. So, did you agree with me over the moon base as wasted money?
I voted for BUSH and probaly will again as I am more afraid of getting another spineless Billboy or worse his wife who does want to ram sozialized health care down our throats.
No matter how you look at it, who is the lesser of the two evils gets my vote.AlaskaBoy.
Posted by: AlaskaBoy
Woodsrunner, I was wrong on the IRA, I was thinking of my 401k. It has gone up as the markets have been improving over the last 18 months, lowering the interest rates helped people feel more secure in buying more expensive stuff and the companys that started to report profit and loss correctly helped it go up.
I was wondering if and when they do open a Moon base if that is where we will be able to ride?HAHA.
Lets get back to talking quads as nobody agrees over politics, okay? AlaskaBoy.
Posted by: AlaskaBoy
After reading the quote posted by just4kicks I learned that I am wealthy and here I thought we were just getting by, how stupid of me. I can't wait to tell the wife that we are wealthy.
Welfare shouls be limited to a max of 1 year, then get your a@# back to work, McDonalds is always hiring. AlaskaBoy.
Posted by: AlaskaBoy
Raptoryfm660r,
HUH? What does this mean?AlaskaBoy.
Posted by: grizz76
Does anyone know where John Kerry stands on this issue. I dont think Howard Dean has a shot at getting the Democratic nomination. I dont think either can beat Bush or I hope not anyway. But I think Kerry can give him a run. Just my opinion.
Posted by: blakey2002400ex
I would never vote for any man that can not even decide where he stand on an issue, I belive we all have to vote and show the DEMOCRATES They can not pull the wool over our eyes.
VOTE FOR GEORGE BUSH
Posted by: ATLRAPPY
I think everyone should vote
Posted by: hellbilly
got this from another forum...
"As unsavory is it may be to many of us, it's my experience that it
really does matter that we as riders participate in politics. So as we
move toward November 2004, it is important to ask any given local or
national candidate how pro- or anti-OHV he or she is.
That said, I will always steer clear of telling you how to think, but
please do consider the following evidence and make your own decisions:
On former VT Governor, Dr. Howard Dean, Democratic nomination contestant
for Pres.-`04, VT OHV advocate Todd Sheinfeld had this to say:
"...I had several conversations with Howard Dean over the years, one on
[VT radio program] Switchboard many years ago. In that exchange, the
former Governor expressed to me that he did not like, nor see any use
for, ATVs and the fact that they are not allowed on public land in VT
(whether federal or state) was a great accomplishment. He further told
me that if he, as Governor, could outlaw ATV use on private land he
would do it in a second..."
[From Todd's article at
http://www.vtvasa.org/sitebuildercontent/s.../myjourneytotruenorth.pdf
Todd also directs us to the very telling paragraph copied below from the
"LA Weekly." (Full article: "The Doctor is In: Rolling with
people-powered Howard Dean..." see
http://www.laweekly.com/ink/03/41/features-wolf.php
[On the recent "preservation" in Vermont of 133,000 acres of the former
Champion Paper Company lands, Jamie Wolf wrote:]
"[Dean] and his team used the NRA, he says, to neutralize the most
ardent property-rights Republicans in the legislature. They then went to
the snowmobilers and explained that although there would be a wilderness
area off-limits to them, there would be other areas they could utilize.
They used that concession, he goes on, to get the snowmobilers' help in
supporting the exclusion of ATVs: "You can't compromise with ATVers
under any circumstances, they just do too much damage to the land..." In
other words, Dean says, you assemble the broadest coalition possible and
then parcel out something for everybody. "Now, it can't be everybody,
because there's always those on the extreme edge of the right who want
to clear-cut everything, that's their idea of sustainable timbering..."
But in general, he says, you work with all the stakeholders, and then if
one element of the coalition starts to defect, if the snowmobilers, say,
try to link up with the ATVers, which they sometimes threaten to do,
"you put the leverage on. You say, 'If it's a choice between letting the
ATVs in or keeping the snowmobile people out - sorry, we'll see you
later.' And that brings the snowmobilers back to the table..."
i just have one thing to say... LMAO@ anyone telling me what i can and cant do on my own land!
Posted by: deanz400
hat was a pretty good rant there alaska boy the biggest thing is how do we as americans get people to take responsibility for there own actions ?? that would stop the frivolus law suits . how about putting some judges up there in the higher courts to stop stupid people , speaking of which they should repeal a required helmet and seat belt laws so we can get rid of more stupid people , because there polluting the gene pool with stupidity . what ever we do don't let stupid people listen to demaocrats or tree hugging liberals then they get that 1000 yard stare and think they don't need to take personal responsabilty for themselves or there actions .bushes enviromental policy is a heck of a lot better then any one on the demacrates policies . just say no to any democrates !!!!
Posted by: deanz400
ey bottom line people the general knowledge is that most if not all liberals or democrats want to take our riding rights away and in general you can blame who you want but the out right knowledge is republicans want smaller gov. ( ie less taxes ) and the democrates just want you to give them your money ,so they can invest it in welfare systems , so they have a voter base they can control. if you want to know the average americans , or the welthy anyone making over 60,000 a year thats what the democrates say is welthy , pay like 92% of the tax base of this country and the top 1%earners pay over 50% of the tax base . the republicans are the only party that is trying to give some thing back to the general population.not just the welfare recipiants . hey spudss you want 3rd world why don't you join a military service and have them send you to iraq . thats where i am right now and if you think a 3rd world nation is so great you should see what a leader like saddam did to a country that had more free welth then many and what kind of abject poverty these people live in . when's the last time you lived in a mud block hut with a dirt floor ,you should try it .it's not pretty .
sincerely SSG Dean G.
Posted by: deanz400
thats why we have to keep guys like kerry out of the white house , there the ones taking away the morals of the country .there the ones that are taking the pledge out of our schools and replaceing it with how to use a condom !! oh and for sure don't let our kids know that absentance is a 100% effective in birth control .oh yea lets not forget can't hurt johnnys self esteem , sorry a kid is not dumb they know when thry are failing , so lets just lower all the standards so no one fails . WRONG WRONG lets raise the standards and push our children and let our country rise to the top . i'm sick of hearing how america is falling behind the rest of the world !!!img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-mad.gif" border="0">
say spudss i'd like to thank youfor also serving our great country , but folks lets keep people like kerrry out of office !!!!!!!!!
Posted by: Lon371
DITTO TO THE SSG DEAN FROM INDIANA
Posted by: yamachevy
this should remind us all that the safer we ride, the more respect we will get
Remember TREAD LIGHTLY- noone said it was gunna be easy, but at least we will keep our beautiful riding areas
