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Posted by: LT80
In trying to deside what quad for Big Bad Angela to race for next year, we looked back at this last GNC season.
The Honda is the winner. The Yamaha motor has proven to be less than reliable. Kory Ellis and Keith Little have had plenty of motor trouble this year.
This is a highly debatable subject. Everyone loves one or the other. BR>How about::
How many old yamaha's you see around?
How many old honda's you see around?
Maybe the answer is somewhere in there. BR>My 2 cents.
Posted by: 2stroke4ever
I have a deposit on a YFZ (refundable) but now I'm hesitating. I sat on a 450R and love the way it feels. It's really comfortable. That's not to say I don't like the way the YFZ feels. Besides the great things I've heard about the YFZ in terms of power and handling, I like that fact that it feels smaller. The YFZ feels more like my Tecate 4 and the 450R feels more like my 250R.
Here's my question: does anyone feel one is better suited to GNCC/Woods style riding? I don't race but my idea of trail riding doesn't involve putting around and smelling the leaves. I ride fast and like jumping and zipping thru rough spots.
Now I know both quads are well suited for this kind of riding and I know some would say that the Raptor or Predator are still better suited to any kind of woods riding because of the bigger bore and extra torque. But I don't like the size of those. I'd rather ride something I can flick around...like my 2 strokes. But I'm getting to the point where I'd like a quad that combines the better of both worlds.
BTW, and should probably post this in a separate thread, anyone put flywheel weights on a YFZ with good results? I figure slowing down the revs a tad would add some torque without sacrificing its power advantage over the 450R.
Posted by: 2stroke4ever
Quote
Originally posted by: 13inc
I race cross country on my 05 YFZ and love it! I can tell you that if you are a taller rider you might consider these mods to make the quad alot more comfortable(Roll Design Race pegs 1/2 in. lower than stock and a +2 stem).I am 6'1 and these mods make it feel much more comfy on the long hauls......
Thanks for the tips. I'm 6ft. and I'm seriously considering getting one. I got the cash saved and I'm hunting for a good deal on used one.
Posted by: 2stroke4ever
Quote
Originally posted by: exracer131
i myself own a trx450r. before i bought the honda i rode a friend of mine yzf 450 on a x-country track we race on in west tn. i found the yfz has a stiff ride. i made several laps on the track while adjusting to shocks each lap. i could not get a good ride out of the stockers. i myself felt the yfz was small and cramped. yes you can spend around $500 to make the quad comfurtable. i took a gamble and ordered 450r before they even hit the market. it did not take long for me to relise the honda has a better ride with stock equipment. btw i am right at 200lbs and 6'1. i did spend some time setting the stock shocks for my liking. there is pros and cons on both quads, you cant go wrong with either one. i my opinon if you do go with the yfz junk the shocks and buy better a-arms. the a-arms are prone to bend. i am assuming you trail ride like you are racing, if so you are aware what hitting a tree will do. now for the power differance there is not that much. i have 17 xc races and 5 mx races on my 450r, i have never been beat because of lack of hp. it is always lack of ability. here is the real question ford or chevy. my advice is try to ride both machines as much as possiable before you make your choice.
Thanks for your input. It's the best answer I've had. Man, I wish I could ride them both a lot but I don't know anyone that has them and the dealers aren't about to let me rip around on both for a few hours. All I have been able to do is sit on them at the dealer and read about them in magazines.
The sum of my learning is that according to magazines, both handle very well but the YFZ handles better at high speed, is more fatiguing to ride, is stiffer, has more power and quicker acceleration. The Honda has smoother power, more lowend and softer suspension. From sitting on them, the Honda feels bigger and more roomy while the YFZ feels a bit more compact but not cramped. It's like the difference between my Tecate (like YFZ) and my 250R (like 450R). I feel "in and behind" the R and "on top of" of the YFZ. Neither is uncomfortable but the Honda is a little more comfortable in general. But I do feel more CONFIDENT on the Tecate because it feels smaller. Psychological I guess. BTW, I'm 6 ft. and about 185 lbs.
Posted by: 2stroke4ever
I will add this to elaborate on what exracer131 was saying about comfort and ridability. AtvRider's Torture Test:
http://www.atvrideronline.com/tested/
they did a 12 hour torture test on the 4 performance quads with riders of all skill levels including pros that race the YFZ. The overwhelming consensus winner was the 450R for prolonged riding comfort thru varied terrain. The YFZ actually came in last for being the most harsh and fatiguing thru long rides. I'm not knocking the YFZ. I think it's awesome but I feel this study by ATV Rider is worthy of attention.
Posted by: maddog56
Perhaps you can take into account that the yfz was the best selling atv, raptor number 2. If there are more bikes there are going to be more problems. The 04 models were also notably less reliable than the 05, as were the early 04 vs the mid and late 04's. Now the 06 has just over 80 changes to the bike and a few more cc's. The 450R was made a turd from the factory to keep things "honda safe and reliable" and they paid the performance price for it. Now they release a more direct pull from the motorcycle and something they should have included from the beginning, a better carb and electric start.
Posted by: 13inc
I race cross country on my 05 YFZ and love it! I can tell you that if you are a taller rider you might consider these mods to make the quad alot more comfortable(Roll Design Race pegs 1/2 in. lower than stock and a +2 stem).I am 6'1 and these mods make it feel much more comfy on the long hauls......
Posted by: exracer131
i myself own a trx450r. before i bought the honda i rode a friend of mine yzf 450 on a x-country track we race on in west tn. i found the yfz has a stiff ride. i made several laps on the track while adjusting to shocks each lap. i could not get a good ride out of the stockers. i myself felt the yfz was small and cramped. yes you can spend around $500 to make the quad comfurtable. i took a gamble and ordered 450r before they even hit the market. it did not take long for me to relise the honda has a better ride with stock equipment. btw i am right at 200lbs and 6'1. i did spend some time setting the stock shocks for my liking. there is pros and cons on both quads, you cant go wrong with either one. i my opinon if you do go with the yfz junk the shocks and buy better a-arms. the a-arms are prone to bend. i am assuming you trail ride like you are racing, if so you are aware what hitting a tree will do. now for the power differance there is not that much. i have 17 xc races and 5 mx races on my 450r, i have never been beat because of lack of hp. it is always lack of ability. here is the real question ford or chevy. my advice is try to ride both machines as much as possiable before you make your choice.
Posted by: exracer131
to 450grrl repley, i take it you race mx. if so you do want a stiff shock. if i am not wrong he does mostly trail riding. who wants stiff shock in the woods. yes i see that you race the worcs series,but the terrian is a little differant on our side of the planet. you go to anyone of the gncc races and check out some of the pro or pro am riders and bet their suspenion is nice and plush. to the remark i made about the yfz aarms are weak. there are serveral guys that run in the xc series i race in that had hit a tree with the front tire and the a-arms bent. all the guys this happened to had the same remark( this aarm should have never bent, i didn't even get thrown over the bars)
Posted by: Raptor660Rshee350
My friend got an 04 YFZ and he loves it. It actually has a 2-stroke feel to it beacuse it revs really fast, ahh maybe its just me. I think it handles really well in the trails for a race bike. I thought it was really quick as well it beat a stock banshee in a short race.
Posted by: CaptainToyota
I know that some racers who do XC racing prefer the TRX450R because its powerband is a little bit more mellow.
Im 5'11" tall and I love the way the YFZ fits me. The handlebar, shifter, and foot brake fit me just right.
My brother has an '04 Predator TLD and I feel stretched-out on it. I have to reach for the handlebars, shifter and foot brake.
The YFZ does have a really stiff suspension though. When you sit on a Raptor or Predator the suspension has 2" of sit-in, but when you sit on a YFZ it sags MAYBE 1/2". I personally like the YFZ's firm suspension.
As for whats faster, I think its more the rider than the machine. Ive seen TRX450Rs smoke YFZs, Ive seen YFZs smoke TRX450Rs and Ive seen Predators smoke both of them. However, it seems like the YFZs win more often than not.
It seems to me that you cant really go wrong either way.
Cap'n
Posted by: paintballbanshee
i am 2 tired to read what u said but keep the yfz if u get the honda u will miss the power, its not that much buts its noticeable
Posted by: paintballbanshee
the honda is betta for dunes thats it, unless u mod them out like crazy then the yfz has it in every subject
Posted by: TrXFoFiddyR
450r
Posted by: 450grrl
I used to love my Honda.....but I've owned more Yamaha's than anything since I started riding 4 years ago.......and I have a YFZ 450 that I've been racing the snot out of for over a year and half. Up until a couple of months ago, I raced it the whole time with stock suspension. Now, at 135 pounds, you'd think if the shocks were too stiff that I would have a problem with it......well, the YFZ shocks are awesome for stock suspension!! The upper a-arms are not weak - I don't know ANYONE that I race or ride with that has bent a stock a-arm. I even crashed and bent my stock shock into a "U", but my a-arms were perfectly straight. I race motocross, with some WORCS races thrown in......dune riding......a little desert racing........the YFZ is an all around awesome quad. I'm 5'10" and it's not too small for me.
As far as the engine issues Mr. Moore pointed out.......I've seen more Honda's being towed off the track blowing out smoke than I have Yamaha's over the past year. If I have my information correct, Keith Little's engine's are BUILT engines, so are Kory Ellis's.....once you start boring/stroking the engines in any quad, you can't point to the manufacturer as being responsible for any engine failures. It's the engine builder's problems at that point..........Stock for stock, you can no longer say Honda is more dependable than Yamaha anymore........times have definately changed.
As far as how many old Yami's I see around??? Banshee's, Blasters and Warriors EVERYWHERE!!! Locally - YFZ's pretty much dominate the MX tracks........and I can't count how many Raptors I see on the trails and at the dunes.
I say don't balk on the YFZ - just get it. You will love it !! Get the cam mod done, open up the intake and exhaust and it will fly. It's got amazing handling, it's light, and it has all the power you will need when you need it. You can soften up the stock shocks considerably - like I said, I raced mine and was doing VERY well on stock suspension!
Just my .02
Posted by: 450grrl
Yes, I'm mostly an MXer....with some desert and WORCS racing thrown in. I try not to hit trees, so I have not had the issue of the bent a-arms! I have, however, nailed a few HUGE rocks with my front wheels - enought to taco my rims but still never bent an a-arm. I can understand if you want a plusher ride in the woodsy type riding......I guess there is alot more sitting involved in that type of riding? I know there are quite a few desert racers that also switched over to the 450R because they said it's just a more comfortable, less fatiguing ride for long distances......so there are more 450R's, and Bombardier's in the longer desert racers these days than anything else.
I just had to argue about the weak a-arm comment and the reliability comment in the Yamaha's behalf. From someone who has tons of experience owning, riding with, and racing with YFZ's, as well as having a husband who also repairs/replaces/restores engines for a living....I wanted to be sure to clear up a few misconceptions.
