Why Chinese??????

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Posted by: MUDDY4LIFE

Its insane to spend 2700 bucks for a TRX 90cc Honda with less features than most Chinese ATVs for about 800 bucks,just because it says HONDA on the side of it. I've owned good Chinese and bad Chinese ATVs. Most of the problems come with the person who preps the machine when it comes in. If performed properly and everything is lock tight, many Chinese ATVs will offer years of fun and enjoyment to a kid who will outgrow the machine much faster than you think.

I refuse to pay the high price dollars the Japs want for my kids ATV when I know I can find a good Chinese one for a fraction of the costs.Find a GOOD DEALER who has PARTS,you'll be fine.

Bill

Posted by: Scootergptx

Weren't the ones made in Taiwan in question about comparison to the Japanese models at one time?

Kymco is even opening a production plant in Japan. It will be for scooters though. For now.

I do see the Chinese quads improving in quality. Not sure of the timetable. But I also see them figuring out the same thing the Taiwan models figured out. With better quality, you can charge a higher price.

Posted by: Scootergptx

There is a Yamaha dealer not too far from here that carries the Kymco line. Talked to one of the salesman, and even he was surprised at how well they were selling. They're not taking away sales from the Rappy or the 450, but they sure are selling well to the people who are new to the sport.

Back on topic.

Yeah the Chinese quads are a majority of POS, but not all.

Anyone remember the quality of Polaris in the early 90's?

And where do they rank in sales today?

Posted by: Scootergptx

Originally posted by: mywifesquad

Originally posted by: billl2099

i receive e-mails all the time from people wanting to sell me their chinese junk, the most recent was from a guy in las vegas 2 almost new hi birds 200, he wanted $650 for both.

Originally posted by: billl2099

i've read nothing but good reviews on the hi birds and haven't read anything negitive on them,

I guess you dont read your own posts? /end quote>

LOL!

Shoes? You guys got wives that let you buy shoes????

Posted by: Scootergptx

Originally posted by: billl2099

after owning 8 chinese POS would not buy eaither one, i'd look at close out deals on a polaris, cam an or artic cat's , i've already seem an ad for a close out cam an ds 250 for 2795 so i know theirs deals out there.

Stay away from the ds 250. Gotta be the most underpowered 250 out there. And no aftermarket products for it. At least the AC dvx is a Kymco with different plastic. Plenty of aftermarket parts for it.

Paid 2700 for the ds and the wife hates it. I'd just like to sell it, but she wants to keep it for a ride for others (seems I'm in the quad loaning field) to ride after I rebuild her Trail Blazer.

Posted by: mywifesquad

Originally posted by: billl2099

i've read nothing but good reviews on the hi birds and haven't read anything negitive on them,

I guess you dont read your own posts?

Posted by: billl2099

i hate to admit it but i was one of them, it's the price, after owning 8 chinese atv's i have only one conclusion, they're completely junk, no matter which brand you buy from sunl to jetmoto. i will always spend the extra money now for a japanese or american atv before wasting my money on chinese crap. out of 8 chinese atv, only 2 hadn't had a problem and i think they know if they break it's the dumpster for them, i won't even try and fix them no matter what it is or how simple the problem is , i'm just going to trash it. chinese atv's have absolute no resell valve, i receive e-mails all the time from people wanting to sell me their chinese junk, the most recent was from a guy in las vegas 2 almost new hi birds 200, he wanted $650 for both.

Posted by: billl2099

I know there is good Chinese bike out there,

if you find one let us know, but at this time i don't think so.

Posted by: billl2099

what i can't understand if any other comsumer product was made with this poor quality nobody would accept it, but some how these chinese atv's are. i don't care what price i pay for an item i expect it to perform for a reasonable amount of time.

Posted by: billl2099

Originally posted by: kczukiman

Originally posted by: billl2099

what i can't understand if any other comsumer product was made with this poor quality nobody would accept it, but some how these chinese atv's are. i don't care what price i pay for an item i expect it to perform for a reasonable amount of time.

Just like televisions,washing machines,dryers and many other products.they are now desposable.You use them till they break then buy another.Who's generation caused that? Not the average are of the consumers today.........

i have no problems wth these being a desposable item, the problem i have is that they should work and last a reasonable amount of time, even the cheapest of all cheapest washing machines will last for years, not hours.

Posted by: billl2099

Originally posted by: QuadRider101

These guys said it I'm concerned that Honda has a better warrante, they'll sell me 2 JetMoto 200cc for less that the TRX and I can canibalize the second bike. They said i'd probably not have to do that untill 2010. So enjoy both Bikes. I can't afford a Honda, went and looked at the Raptor 250, not for $4000, Going with American Outlaw Motorsports and buy a 200 JetMoto.

if you really decided on a chinese atv, myself would not waste extra money on the jetmoto, you owe it to yourself to look on e-bay for the 200 hi bird, price is 800 with a single swing arm or 900 with a double swing arm, less $50 if you call in to order, price includes shipping, i've read nothing but good reviews on the hi birds and haven't read anything negitive on them, thats more than i can say on the jetmoto, besides both atv's use the same engine and other componits, i myself
after owning 8 chinese POS would not buy eaither one, i'd look at close out deals on a polaris, cam an or artic cat's , i've already seem an ad for a close out cam an ds 250 for 2795 so i know theirs deals out there.

Posted by: billl2099

Originally posted by: QuadRider101

Here's the reality of Chinese bikes...first I don't know where you get the figure of

$1600 - $2100 for an atv, even a used Honda or Yamaha. I have a 250cc Hi-Bird

and a 11occ Wangli Loncin, what ever it is....we are trying to find their breaking point, and havn't found it yet, the batteries are P.O.S. but the engine'skeep going,

We don't jump the bikes because I have a family to support, but I climb hills, donuts, Bogs, reach very fast speeds, they are not the smoothest rides, but most of the time we are standing on the pegs, we have been riding them all summer nearly every day for 30 min's to 1 hour and all the need is 10W-40, 91 octane, and a battery charger.

China bikes are "re-engineered", why is the recording industry, the clothing industry so concerned about China's products? They are very similar to the real thing, except for the lead paint. China bikes are way ahead of their time....They are like Honda was in 1967 a small moped looking thing known as Jap Junk, not the case today. Those bikes were considered P.O.S. back then. Then we moved on too Taiwan. Things made there in the 80-90's were Junk, now we have Kymco, a Brand Name product you will see on the second page of Dirt Wheels Magazine.

Half the worlds Motorcycles come out of China, I'll reference later. In China, everyone rides Motorcycles, why? They cannot afford cars, they ride 1 motorcycle, and the bikes...ever see that Nat. Geographic Pic of a family of 5 going down the road with the dog on the handle bars and a live chicken in a basket on the back, all riding to the market on a China Motorcycle? How about Warranty, China doesn't have em' they havn't figured that there is big money in it, rather they just switch out parts, like Legos, these things are easy to fix or repair, the Honda and Yamaha bikes cannot afford to have it's consumer to fix their bikes so the parts are very complex and expensive. Infact you can buy three (3) 250cc new bikes for less then one new Yamaha Raptor 250cc. You can "Harvest Parts" and Keep 1 bike going and going and going, you'll have a bunch of new tires, extra fenders, lights starters, carbs, etc..and if you feel like it get them all running and have a blast with the family bustin' dirt rather then bustin' your bank. You cannot finance China bikes and so rarely does someone go into debt financing their fun at 12.99%. Go to the dealer where their is that poster, "No Payments for 6 months", 6 months later you wished you had paid the bike off. So now the Branded Products, which sits in the garage because dad's got to get a second job to finance his new purchase. The best thing China may do for the U.S.A consumer is perhaps let them enjoy the once prohibitive fun of ATV'n without the financial burden on typical big ticket items, like branded ATV's.

The average income of a China factory worker is $1200.00/year. In the U.S.A and in Japan it's $27000.00. A China ATV sells for $1200.00, a Honda or Polar Cat doesn't sell for $27,000.00, the point is this, China can make more bike for less. This gives China Expansion, they are not at the breaking point where they have to charge more for better quality like that of Honda and Yamaha. You will see in the future, China will begin to the U.S.A a Brand Name Bike, they're going to have Hats, Shirts, Decals etc. They'll even have a Racing Team, taking Grand-Prix Trophies. The next thing that will happen is they have a bike as good or better then Honda, or Yamaha. This is what happens when demand vs. price vs. technology collied, Honda, Yamaha loose intellectual rights after 7 years on their products allowing China to re-engineer their Motorcycles. A 2000 Honda ATV, is a great ATV, which is a 2007 China ATV.

Here is the wrap up, Suzuki is now manufacturing in China. I'll reference the articles. Honda Motorsports Engineers are very concerned about the quality comming out of China. Finally all of US steel, Metals, Aluminum that goes into building bikes, comes from China plants. We are at the point that one day you will be riding a Chinese ATV or Motorcycle, not yet convinced, take off your shoe and see where it was made. Happy Riding.

LOL, this posting really funny, yes honda worried about chinese quailty, lack of it, because it becomes a safety concern, their's no way a 2007 chinese quad is anyway close to a 2000 honda in quailty, what have you been smoking? i do agree chinese atv's are re-engineered, but not from honda, yamaha or suzuki quads they re-engineered from other chinese quads, thats why most chinese quads all look the same. i have never known japanese to import a poor quaility m/c or atc, even when the first started importing them in the 60's. yes you can buy 3 chinese quads for the price of one japanese of american quad and harvest parts as you suggested, this is really stupid, to buy 3 to keep 1 running, replacing crap parts with more crap parts, thats just what i want to do, just buy a decent quad to begin with. as far as not being able to finance a chinese quad, over 80% of chinese quads are purchased on the web, so i would suspect 100% of these quads are charged with a credit card, with people paying 20=22% interest rates. did you for get to mention you can't not sue a chinese manufactor for product liability?

Posted by: billl2099

Originally posted by: windtrader

did you for get to mention you can't not sue a chinese manufactor for product liability?

Another distributor, Dinli LP, which once operated out of Dallas, is appealing a $3 million verdict against it. A Philadelphia jury found the Taiwanese company liable for the death of a 31-year-old man who broke one of his legs when his Dinli ATV overturned after the right handle grip slipped off the handlebar. He died from a pulmonary embolism caused by his leg injury.

full article

china and twain the same? i don't think so.

Posted by: billl2099

Originally posted by: mywifesquad

Originally posted by: billl2099

i've read nothing but good reviews on the hi birds and haven't read anything negitive on them,

I guess you dont read your own posts? /end quote>

i haven't read any bad reviews on the hi birds, but that doesn't mean i'd buy any and thats why i turn the 2 hi birds down, not worth my time or money

Posted by: jnt3000

The only reason I got one is for my son is to learn how to ride. He is just about to turn 5 and he only rides on flat ground with us close by with our hand on the kill swtch, once he gets to the point to where he can control it enough we will move him up to a name brand utility ATV so he can take it out on the trails and play in the mud with us. even though iv'e had problems with his i've learned how work on them. we have two name brand ATV's ive spent just as much time on them if you want to keep them running good. The only thing with the cheap one's is you cant run to the corner to pick up parts or pay $60 an hour if you cant fix it your self. I see the Chinese ATV only a step up from a Power Wheel and I know we have all spent money on them. These ATV's are not made to compete with name brands. But Im not going to go pay $2000 on a name brand 50cc/90cc when in a couple years we will be able to pay the same price for a 250cc that will last him intill his teens. But thats only me. Im happy with ours for what we use it for.

Jeff

Posted by: Honeyduck96

Her Chee Trailblazer90 2-stroke...says Adly on various controls. Great little atv. Exactly the same machine under the plastic that BRP was selling (for 3x the price) as their DS90 and DS50. Can get any parts from Can-Am dealer. When I insured it (required here to ride on public land), the papers came back listing it as a Bombardier due to the serial#

Posted by: superdaves

The biggest difference for me is the features available on the bike. I can pay $3000 for a Suzuki Quadsport Z-50 which has limited features other than being made by Suzuki or for $700 I can get a similar 50cc with the following features 1) Headlights 2) Remote start 3) Footbrake 4) Reverse if I go with Semi auto rather than CVT 5) brake light. Now given that these atv's usually stay in use for 2-3 years max, the answer is quite simple. If I was getting a 150 or larger cc bike, then I would consider a brand name but for the younger youth market, there is just no comparison.

Posted by: outofline

First I want to state I don't want to get into a pissing contest, your posting this in the Chinese Forum so here is "Why Chinese". And I'm not saying they have been trouble free cus they haven't and I only hope they will still be running for another fun summer but you asked why!

Here's why

Posted by: outofline

Totally agree AIRMOBILE101! Or I might add a picky consumer, I talked a neighbor out of buying one just cus I knew he was a very picky person and would have been fighting with the dealer nonstop!

Posted by: outofline

I really thought Jetmoto was going to be that big step up in quality over the other Chinese quads. After months of test riding may different Chinese brands and seeing the design of the 07 Jets I thought hey this may be the one that will stand above the others. It truly is much more stable then 95% of them I have rode (we are yet to roll any one of the 4 of the Jets we own) and I do give them an A for design upgrade from the last years models and better then most the other Chinese brands. They still have a lot of build quality problems (QC and testing does not appear to be being preformed here or in China) and I have a real issue with all the rubber parts which are degrading way premature. I think if Jet would make these same units with out major changes for several years to come only fixing the known and obvious problems in two years I think they could have a decent product and I think the only real added expense would be better rubber and plastic which would add a bit to the cost. So far all 4 motors have been good runners and seem to be of a good build quality, just wish the Motor manufacture would build their own quad using their same build quality and that I think that would be a good Chinese quad!

Posted by: outofline

Hi Bird and Jetmoto do not use the same motor, HiBirds are of a Honda copy where the Jet uses a Yamaha copy. From what I know they are both very well built motors and I'm not sure there is an advantage to either. I did have a Drag Race with a 250 Honda water cooled copy Chinese quad which was the same frame as the Hibird and did win with my 250 Jet, not by far but non the less did win several times.
I know Jet has had its problems with some of the 07's new designed parts but I will say this the Jetmotos are so much more stable and a nicer ride then any other Chinese 250 or 150's that I have rode. That 250 I raced rode like a Pogo stick and being the same frame and suspension I'm guessing the Hi Birds ride must be the same! I'm not saying go buy a Jet I'm just stating what I know and have experienced!

Posted by: outofline

I would have to disagree QuadRider, a 2000 Honda was built with better quality parts then my 2007 Jetmoto and I know a lot of Chinese manufactures use the same parts. I think the Chinese are getting better every year but I think the price is going to have to climb if they up the quality or the parts. And also I have seen fairly clean used Japanese Quads for $1500-2100 in my local want ads! My attraction to jet was I thought it would be fun for the entire family to have four new quads and I hoped they would be of decent quality.

Posted by: outofline

My shoes I have on now were made in Vietnam! For what ever that's worth!
And I think windtrader is correct in that the Chinese quads are priced right were they know they can sell their products, I would not have paid over $2000. for a Chinese quad when you can find some fairly clean big 4 for not much more. I got an amazing deal on my Jets because I ordered 4 which enticed me even more to go the Chinese route. Our Jetmoto 150's have been great for our kids 8-13 to learn on and we have had a lot of fun on our 250's but I know I would have been better off investment wise to wait and find 2 Yamaha Warriors (like my brother told me) but I sure my boys will always remember our first outings on our 4 new Jetmotos, just like I can remember our new JC Penny's Mini bikes my parents bought for us.

Posted by: OffRoadNoob

When it comes to chinese quads, some are better than others obviously. It looks like the Jetmotos aren't really that high quality, even though many thought they were. They seem to have many more problems than I've ever had with my 150 gy6 chinese quad (called Easy Vehicle company. lol - how chinese can you get?). Mine is a year and a half old now and has treated me very well. I've only had one problem with it so far, so either I'm lucky or these quads are of better quality than most chinese quads. What happened with mine is that the bolt holding the muffler jiggled loose and fell down on the frame, causing a crack in the exhaust pipe. I repaired the exhaust and put locktite on all the bolts and haven't had a problem since. I've really put the thing through some pretty heavy abuse (jumps, sloppy mud, sandy hills, beach riding and high speeds on rough terrain). I've had the whole thing caked in mud several times now.

For me, it was a good start to get into the sport. I never rode and ATV in my life until I got that quad and now I love riding. I simply didn't have the money to buy a "real" quad. In Canada, quads are just so expensive, even the old ones. So, I managed to get me a cheap 150cc quad and my daughter a 70cc one. Of course, now I'm looking at getting a larger and more reliable quad. Scootergptx, what happened to the quality of Polaris quads in the early 90s? I was looking at a 93 Polaris trail boss with 4x4 for $1900, which was quite a nice price up here. Is it a POS? Maybe I should go with a cheaper old Yamaha or Honda instead? Eventually, I'm going to get a brand new full-sized Japanese quad, but I'm still in University and won't be able to get one of those for a few years.

OffRoadNoob

Posted by: SilveradoSS

Long story short, I like to see my son having fun and riding his own quad. If not for these cheap ATV's, he would be stuck riding with me on my Kawi KFX700, sandwiched between me and the handlebars, or he would be left at home to drive his poor mother insane while I went out riding without him. He couldn't be happier. You should see the smile on his face when he straps on his helmet and takes off. I'm not going to spend $3000+ on a mini Jap quad that he will never fully utilize the capabilities of. I enjoy riding with him and he is learning valuable skills for when he gets a "real" quad in the future. He will own a quality quad in the future. Right now, this cheap ATV gets the job done very well.

And, I kinda enjoy the challenge of overcoming the design issues that come up.

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Ok, I'm gonna start something thats probably gonna cause some some contra.
Why would you buy a Chinese bike in the first place? I have read plenty of post and it seems the majority of them are for related mechanical issues with Chinese bikes. Don't get me wrong, the Taiwan(R.O.C.) and Japan models have issues also, but it just seems everyone has more issues with that no name Chinese bikes. I don't care what kind of mechanic you are , your still spending more time working on that P.O.S. than you (or your son/daugter) riding it. Yes, $600-$800 is cheaper than $1600.00-$2100.00 , but is it really worth it? Is it really worth the $600-$800 to see your child's face when it craps out after the first hour or two?
Do yourself and your kids a favor, buy something that will last!!!!! For $600-$800 , you can pick up a good used name brand if you keep an eye out for it.(i.e. EBAY or craigslist.org). Maybe that nice little chinese bike also has some high level of lead in it!!!!

CHINA= the big Red Industrial Machine

UNITED STATES = The once great PRO- UNION nation that now accepts this crap!!!

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Everyone had good points , thats why I asked , but for the most part , your all somewhat mechanically inclined(Im assuming). Maybe not the best deal for someone "average Joe" that can't spin a wrench.

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Originally posted by: outofline

First I want to state I don't want to get into a pissing contest, your posting this in the Chinese Forum so here is "Why Chinese". And I'm not saying they have been trouble free cus they haven't and I only hope they will still be running for another fun summer but you asked why!

Here's why

I like the video!!!!

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

I guess I should have given the whole story. My buddy had bought one of those Kazuma 90cc bikes for his daughter. I had heard stories about them constantly breaking down.Didnt believe it until he started having trouble with it within the first two weeks. And of course he doen't know how to spin a wrench to save his life. The dealer was no help , so I get stuck working on it(thats what buddies are for). So far , I had to JB weld the fuel tank because it cracked along the seam, Tighten the rear sprocket up(bolts came loose) , clean the carb(tiny a## carb) , trace a bad ground wire. This has all took place within the past month with very little ride time. The ground wire issue was from yesterday. So, maybe Chinese bike is good if you like working on stuff . I just don't think its a bike for someone that can't wrench. I know there is good Chinese bike out there, but the one my buddy got is a P.O.S.

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Originally posted by: billl2099

I know there is good Chinese bike out there,

if you find one let us know, but at this time i don't think so.

LOL, no thanks !!! Ill stick with the name brands.

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Im sure they will eventually get it right --- I guess they can't be that bad since you own four of them. I know this , that Kazuma my buddy has is crap, nobody will change my opinion on it. Quality from Chinese bikes will only improve if consumers start complaining more , then again , if quality improves , the price will surely go up.

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Originally posted by: windtrader

I think the only real added expense would be better rubber and plastic which would add a bit to the cost.

Hey, I'm a few months behind you as a JM rider, so time will tell how many different problems I encounter.

There are three critical and fundamental factors involved with buying a Chinese quad.

** Substandard raw materials

First you must understand the raw materials are not the same quality as proven brands, nor is the finished parts of the same quality.

** Substandard finished parts and components

Obviously, the finished part's quality is inherently compromised using lesser quality raw materials. Production line equipment, techniques, and labor skills are also contributing factors to lesser quality parts.

** Substandard Quality Control

It seems these things are just put together with parts that are not QC'd, nor are there intermediate or final build QC checks. This results in the product being shipped to a customer with something that is almost guaranteed to have some type of problem right away or after some short time on the quad.

Knowing these three critical factors ensures you will have a substandard product compared to a big name unit. That said, there are things you can do to mitigate many of the potential problems. You must be very attuned to inspecting, diagnosing, and fixing all problems as they arise. An occasional rattle, left unheeded, can lead to an expensive and potentially hazardous problem. And with a Chinese quad, there will be many of such instances.

My advice to anyone going this route must:

1) have the skills to wrench on them and have good "motor sense" to where it is almost second nature to pick up on problems as they first start up;

2) have the willingness, patience, and understanding that a Chinese quad is going to take more time to maintain and keep in good running order;

3) understand the inherent substandard weakness throughout the bike and that will always keep you more busy adjusting and replacing parts than a name brand.

4) and finally, you get what you pay for. If you sign up for the above you are able to ride a quad for a quarter or a third of a name brand. If the trade off is worth it by all means go for it; otherwise run as fast you can to some other sport or the bank to get a loan to buy a name brand. :-)

That was very well put!! I think most people are not aware of the quality they are getting when the buy a Chinese bike. They see a bike that is 2-3 times cheaper than the brand name, thinking that the quality is near the same.

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Originally posted by: Honeyduck96

Her Chee Trailblazer90 2-stroke...says Adly on various controls. Great little atv. Exactly the same machine under the plastic that BRP was selling (for 3x the price) as their DS90 and DS50. Can get any parts from Can-Am dealer. When I insured it (required here to ride on public land), the papers came back listing it as a Bombardier due to the serial#

That is a Taiwan based company ---majority of mini quads built there(Taiwan) for the big name manufactures. Kymco builds the 07-08 Kawi 50/90. Kymco brand is cheaper by a few hundred dollars or more.

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Only time will tell!!!!

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

I really want to respond to this, but.........

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Quadrider101, Its apparent you support the whole Chinese movement. Fine, but don't start throwing so called facts out there and then say "I'll reference the articles" or "I'll reference later" . The $1600.00-$2100.00 figure is from ebay or craigslist.org that I had mentioned in the original post . I can go on and on about the Big name financing terms or how you can get three quads for the price of a Raptor 250 , or how Honda will be inferior to Chinese bikes, but I wont. I will say this , my boot says , "REDWING" "MADE IN USA" . My sneakers say, " NEW BALANCE" "MADE IN USA" . Happy Riding!!!

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Originally posted by: outofline

My shoes I have on now were made in Vietnam! For what ever that's worth!/end quote>

LOL

Posted by: AIRMOBILE101

Originally posted by: Scootergptx

Originally posted by: mywifesquad

Originally posted by: billl2099

i've read nothing but good reviews on the hi birds and haven't read anything negitive on them,

I guess you dont read your own posts? [IMG][/IMG]

LOL! [IMG]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif" border="0[/IMG]

Shoes? You guys got wives that let you buy shoes????

Yep , If Im real lucky, I can get a matching shirt also!!!

Posted by: kczukiman

Originally posted by: outofline

I really thought Jetmoto was going to be that big step up in quality over the other Chinese quads. After months of test riding may different Chinese brands and seeing the design of the 07 Jets I thought hey this may be the one that will stand above the others. It truly is much more stable then 95% of them I have rode (we are yet to roll any one of the 4 of the Jets we own) and I do give them an A for design upgrade from the last years models and better then most the other Chinese brands. They still have a lot of build quality problems (QC and testing does not appear to be being preformed here or in China) and I have a real issue with all the rubber parts which are degrading way premature. I think if Jet would make these same units with out major changes for several years to come only fixing the known and obvious problems in two years I think they could have a decent product and I think the only real added expense would be better rubber and plastic which would add a bit to the cost. So far all 4 motors have been good runners and seem to be of a good build quality, just wish the Motor manufacture would build their own quad using their same build quality and that I think that would be a good Chinese quad!

That being said.Do you really think that the price for the Jetmotos are valid compaired to the compitition?I have had my Hi-bird since June and I can honestly say no problems as of yet besides the carb adjusting when I first got it.And when I first joined this site The responses were that Jetmoto is the best product comming out of China.I don't know if I agree with that.I think I would put my wifes Roketa ATV56-A 150 out there as one of the best quality Chines bikes.It is built much better then the HI-Bird.
I think I would agree that Raceway is a dedicated dealer and they seems to be very customer oriented and that is important for this market.

Posted by: kczukiman

Posted by: windtrader

I think the only real added expense would be better rubber and plastic which would add a bit to the cost.

Hey, I'm a few months behind you as a JM rider, so time will tell how many different problems I encounter.

There are three critical and fundamental factors involved with buying a Chinese quad.

** Substandard raw materials
First you must understand the raw materials are not the same quality as proven brands, nor is the finished parts of the same quality.

** Substandard finished parts and components
Obviously, the finished part's quality is inherently compromised using lesser quality raw materials. Production line equipment, techniques, and labor skills are also contributing factors to lesser quality parts.

** Substandard Quality Control
It seems these things are just put together with parts that are not QC'd, nor are there intermediate or final build QC checks. This results in the product being shipped to a customer with something that is almost guaranteed to have some type of problem right away or after some short time on the quad.

Knowing these three critical factors ensures you will have a substandard product compared to a big name unit. That said, there are things you can do to mitigate many of the potential problems. You must be very attuned to inspecting, diagnosing, and fixing all problems as they arise. An occasional rattle, left unheeded, can lead to an expensive and potentially hazardous problem. And with a Chinese quad, there will be many of such instances.

My advice to anyone going this route must:

1) have the skills to wrench on them and have good "motor sense" to where it is almost second nature to pick up on problems as they first start up;

2) have the willingness, patience, and understanding that a Chinese quad is going to take more time to maintain and keep in good running order;

3) understand the inherent substandard weakness throughout the bike and that will always keep you more busy adjusting and replacing parts than a name brand.

4) and finally, you get what you pay for. If you sign up for the above you are able to ride a quad for a quarter or a third of a name brand. If the trade off is worth it by all means go for it; otherwise run as fast you can to some other sport or the bank to get a loan to buy a name brand. :-)

Posted by: windtrader

Kymco is even opening a production plant in Japan.

The Her Chee is Taiwanese, and not "Chinese" in the context of discussion about quality of "Chinese" quads.

The stuff from Taiwan is clearly in a different league and many OEM for name brands. The Taiwanese are also getting a lot of pressure from mainland China and they have cut into their lower sized quad market and have moved into the larger displacement market. It's going to be interesting to see how long before they are successful in selling their under their own brands rather than OEM.

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Posted by: windtrader

I know of no Chinese quad made now that is the same quality as one from Japan or Taiwan. There are four principal reasons the Chinese product is so much cheaper.

1) The quality of raw materials is less than that used in the Japanese. They may be from even the same mold but with weaker and softer steel the parts is more likely to bend and break. They will substitute steel instead of a better alloy metal. The rubber is less quality. The tubing and tires are clearly less quality. Frames are not painted with the same number of primer, base and finish coats. Again, less qualtiy. The list goes on.

2) Quality Control is nearly non existent in China. Even though their labor is already so cheap, expending no or very little labor on QC just produces less quality finished goods. I still can not understand why they don't spend a dollar on locktite and ensure all nuts and bolts are tightened to proper torque and secured with the locktite. Many premature problems would disappear for a small investment.

3) Labor is cheapest in China. Once they develop the same skilled workforce their labor rates will increase.

4) Lack of formal dealer networks. The dealers for all big name quads add significant value by ensuring the quad is prepped properly before being handed over to the owner. Many problems with Chinese quads arise from a 400 pound box being drop shipped to an end user's garage and left to his own wits and skills, or lack thereof, to assemble, prep, adjust, test, and end up with a properly setup quad. Odds are most are ridden out of adjustment, with loose bolts, and even tires lacking proper inflation.

IF and when they decide to make improvements in any of the above, the cost is going to increase. Yes better quality but it moves the product into a more difficult price point. Right now, you can still find most can tilt the scales toward a Chinese quad over a new and even used Japanese quad based on price savings.

My view is the Chinese are in right place for now. If they bring up the above aspects, the price will increase to the point where one finds a nice used Japanese for the same money. Some may argue but I do not feel you can get a good used Japanese quad for the same money to by a similar sized/equipped Chinese quad. If that happens most of us here would likely have decided to buy the nice used Japanese quad but if you only have X dollars to spend and it is not enough to buy nice used Japanese quads you are pretty much forced into a Chinese quad if you want to get a ride.

To me this is the reason you find a lot less mid-large cc quads. They require more robust frames, parts, and construction. So the Chinese have less price savings on point 1 above. The more powerful quads require more QC than the small displacement quads. Big horsepower will rip loose parts off in a big hurry, so they loss price advantage on point 2. In order to build better quality parts and better QC requires more skilled labor, thus losing advantage on point 3. What happens and you can easily verify this yourself, is to compare the prices of the larger cc Chinese quads. They really cost quite a bit. Sure less than the similar Japanese quad but not nearly as dramatic a difference as the low cc stuff. It is here where they face the situation described above. I don't think nearly as many are willing to shell out 3+ grand on a Chinese quad when they can find a nice used Japanese quad for the same price. I don't see the Chinese competing with the big brands in the larger quads for a very long time. That said, they have hammered the bottom of the market and the Taiwanese are moving up and getting out of the small stuff as they can't complete with Chinese. There is no easy money for anyone in this market.

Posted by: windtrader

did you for get to mention you can't not sue a chinese manufactor for product liability?

Posted by: trentona1

I agree with you guys for the most part. I ride a modified banshee. My wife and kids have Sunl and hensim bikes. I like having these bikes in the gargae because they give me something to work on. I jsut posted a new topic under kids quads about a remote start only problem. For the money our two bikes have ran pretty good. My wife and kid ride these bikes harder than I rdie mine and we usually don't have any problems.

Posted by: QuadRider101

*** Post Edited by Moderator. Troll for a dealership. Content removed ***

Posted by: QuadRider101

Here's the reality of Chinese bikes...first I don't know where you get the figure of
$1600 - $2100 for an atv, even a used Honda or Yamaha. I have a 250cc Hi-Bird
and a 11occ Wangli Loncin, what ever it is....we are trying to find their breaking point, and havn't found it yet, the batteries are P.O.S. but the engine'skeep going,
We don't jump the bikes because I have a family to support, but I climb hills, donuts, Bogs, reach very fast speeds, they are not the smoothest rides, but most of the time we are standing on the pegs, we have been riding them all summer nearly every day for 30 min's to 1 hour and all the need is 10W-40, 91 octane, and a battery charger.

China bikes are "re-engineered", why is the recording industry, the clothing industry so concerned about China's products? They are very similar to the real thing, except for the lead paint. China bikes are way ahead of their time....They are like Honda was in 1967 a small moped looking thing known as Jap Junk, not the case today. Those bikes were considered P.O.S. back then. Then we moved on too Taiwan. Things made there in the 80-90's were Junk, now we have Kymco, a Brand Name product you will see on the second page of Dirt Wheels Magazine.
Half the worlds Motorcycles come out of China, I'll reference later. In China, everyone rides Motorcycles, why? They cannot afford cars, they ride 1 motorcycle, and the bikes...ever see that Nat. Geographic Pic of a family of 5 going down the road with the dog on the handle bars and a live chicken in a basket on the back, all riding to the market on a China Motorcycle? How about Warranty, China doesn't have em' they havn't figured that there is big money in it, rather they just switch out parts, like Legos, these things are easy to fix or repair, the Honda and Yamaha bikes cannot afford to have it's consumer to fix their bikes so the parts are very complex and expensive. Infact you can buy three (3) 250cc new bikes for less then one new Yamaha Raptor 250cc. You can "Harvest Parts" and Keep 1 bike going and going and going, you'll have a bunch of new tires, extra fenders, lights starters, carbs, etc..and if you feel like it get them all running and have a blast with the family bustin' dirt rather then bustin' your bank. You cannot finance China bikes and so rarely does someone go into debt financing their fun at 12.99%. Go to the dealer where their is that poster, "No Payments for 6 months", 6 months later you wished you had paid the bike off. So now the Branded Products, which sits in the garage because dad's got to get a second job to finance his new purchase. The best thing China may do for the U.S.A consumer is perhaps let them enjoy the once prohibitive fun of ATV'n without the financial burden on typical big ticket items, like branded ATV's.

The average income of a China factory worker is $1200.00/year. In the U.S.A and in Japan it's $27000.00. A China ATV sells for $1200.00, a Honda or Polar Cat doesn't sell for $27,000.00, the point is this, China can make more bike for less. This gives China Expansion, they are not at the breaking point where they have to charge more for better quality like that of Honda and Yamaha. You will see in the future, China will begin to the U.S.A a Brand Name Bike, they're going to have Hats, Shirts, Decals etc. They'll even have a Racing Team, taking Grand-Prix Trophies. The next thing that will happen is they have a bike as good or better then Honda, or Yamaha. This is what happens when demand vs. price vs. technology collied, Honda, Yamaha loose intellectual rights after 7 years on their products allowing China to re-engineer their Motorcycles. A 2000 Honda ATV, is a great ATV, which is a 2007 China ATV.

Here is the wrap up, Suzuki is now manufacturing in China. I'll reference the articles. Honda Motorsports Engineers are very concerned about the quality comming out of China. Finally all of US steel, Metals, Aluminum that goes into building bikes, comes from China plants. We are at the point that one day you will be riding a Chinese ATV or Motorcycle, not yet convinced, take off your shoe and see where it was made. Happy Riding.